Type S v. Scion tc with options...A Real Question of Cars [Archive] - Club RSX Message Board

: Type S v. Scion tc with options...A Real Question of Cars


ask4isk
06-27-2004, 01:46 PM
There is another post about the tc v. the base RSX. I'm not interested in that comparison, because I was never interested in the base RSX. For me, it was the Type S or nothing from Acura. The 6speed manual transmission was huge for me, and might well be the saving grace for Type S IMO. I went to the movies yesterday, and before the movie there was a commercial for the tc. It was very similar to the RSX commercial that is on tv, but the tc commercial was more futuristic and had annimation. I was struck with how good looking the tc was, and how solid the stance was. As far as I'm concerned, Toyota just did not make a car that I was into, except for the IS300 or Supra (I do not like the Celica or MR2 or any of the others) but those cars are out of my range. For me, Toyota seemed to make the right trucks, but not the right cars. Honda made the right car, the Type S. There are some things that I never liked about the Type S, like the wheels, and tiny rear windows, and super-small sunroof, and crappy speakers, and I do not think that the turning radius is as good as it should be. But there are plenty of things about the Type S that I love...and that is why it is my car. But seriously, look at this Scion tc, and look at the base price and how you can option it:
http://www.nctd.com/review-intro.cfm?Vehicle=2005_Scion_tC&ReviewID=1566
I'd be very surprised if Honda did not counter some of this with the '05 model, but the ability to factory customize the tc makes it a much more accessible car than the Type S. Look at the sunroof on that thing, and standard 17s with factory optional 18s or 19s, and a factory optional supercharger...heck, all of the TRD stuff. I'll be watching these cars carefully as they roll out over the next few months (they come out this week), and I might even go to a lot and drive one. Looks like real competition.

rsxdude
06-27-2004, 02:46 PM
I think it is great that they came up with the concept of having more options in performance rather than just accessories. The motor is decent and the car looks great in my opinion and the price is just right for a starter. I think the RSX is a better car though. But for the prices, you can't beat the tc unless you want a geo or kia.

DavidT
06-27-2004, 02:54 PM
Supercharged tC won't be out for awhile. My Scion dealer said the earliest they may see one is December. However, many n/a tCs are already being sold...nice cars.

ombastic
06-27-2004, 03:24 PM
when i first heard of the new tC, i was surprised that for such a low price it had all these options and the power of the engine is pretty decent. might be stupid but after hearing the arrival of the new tC, i was disappointed in my type s, :(. but of course the rsx is a better car because it does cost more.

DavidT
06-27-2004, 03:28 PM
might be stupid but after hearing the arrival of the new tC, i was disappointed in my type s, :(. but of course the rsx is a better car because it does cost more.

What? The tC uses a 160HP Camry motor...not to mention a weasy 6200 RPM redline! For it to make the same HP as the Type S it needs a supercharger. Type S is way superior to the tC, even the supercharged one. 100 HP per liter n/a...c'mon dude. :thumbsup:

crazy
06-27-2004, 08:06 PM
However, the torque on the supercharged Scion is 206. That's a considerable number.

SilverRSXJezus
07-05-2004, 10:29 AM
Well, if the tC really turns out to be just that great and all, it'll probably become the new civic thing. Remember, sometimes if a car is made to be vey low costing yet it gives a lot...a lot of people will buy it and it'll be one of those cars that you see everywhere. besides that, i'm sure it's a nice car since it's coming from scion/toyota...but i'd still like to keep my base rsx

crazy
07-05-2004, 10:43 AM
The morons at Scion/Toy aren't bringing them or any Scion's here :firemad: We get the Vitz instead. Oh yay.

theporschephile
07-05-2004, 01:07 PM
What? The tC uses a 160HP Camry motor...not to mention a weasy 6200 RPM redline! For it to make the same HP as the Type S it needs a supercharger. Type S is way superior to the tC, even the supercharged one. 100 HP per liter n/a...c'mon dude. :thumbsup:
lmao man. needs a 2.4L? that's the absolute most asanine statement i've ever heard on clubRSX. It doesn't need a 2.4L to make that power. It's just a camry engine, meaning an engine from a mid-size family sedan. it's not supposed to be some sort of crazy high-hp high-revving engine. Notice it has an FE head. If it was a GE head, u could argue that it was made for power. Not only that, tehy'd probably use lift, and other crazy features like the K20.


Also, look at the torque, 20 more ft-lbs over the Type-S, and that's raised to 206 after the supercharger is added. Plus, tehy're actually using a Vortech as opposed to the Roots style that's used for teh other TRD superchargers, so there's a lot more potential for it.

ombastic
07-05-2004, 05:59 PM
lmao man. needs a 2.4L? that's the absolute most asanine statement i've ever heard on clubRSX. It doesn't need a 2.4L to make that power. It's just a camry engine, meaning an engine from a mid-size family sedan. it's not supposed to be some sort of crazy high-hp high-revving engine. Notice it has an FE head. If it was a GE head, u could argue that it was made for power. Not only that, tehy'd probably use lift, and other crazy features like the K20.


Also, look at the torque, 20 more ft-lbs over the Type-S, and that's raised to 206 after the supercharger is added. Plus, tehy're actually using a Vortech as opposed to the Roots style that's used for teh other TRD superchargers, so there's a lot more potential for it.

yeah i think the tC with a few thousand put into it would totally own a stock type s. =(

GrungeRSX
07-05-2004, 11:11 PM
Yeah, well, type s w/ a few thousand put into it would eat tC for lunch. Have you seen turboed RSX w/ 300+ horsepower?

BTS
07-05-2004, 11:39 PM
its all fun and games till you have to tell people you own a scion.....its not a lexus....its not even the lower toyota.....its the even lower scion.....you might as well just go gay and drive a pink volkswagen beetle

GrungeRSX
07-06-2004, 12:05 AM
I wouldn't say that. I would pick tC over Camrys or Corollas any time. tC is pretty cool, I have to say, but then a lot of cars now are coming w/ more 'sporty' packages. I saw this car from Hyundai or Kia or something and it's as cheap as lower civic models but as well sport-equipped as base RSX.. tC is a good option for people considering base RSX. However, can't be compared to S. Type S's engine efficiency and output and the higher redline and iVTEC are a different breed that cars like tC would be hard to compare against. People keep saying 'if tC did this or that' but the truth will be that the vast majority of new tC owners will not go for supercharger or any kinda speed-minded mods, just like the vast majority of RSXs you see on the street are total stocks.

shaggy
07-06-2004, 12:09 AM
did any of you actually read the article....

Scion has chosen a menu of 40 different freestanding options, more than any other car in its class, ranging from a $4500 supercharger kit good for 200 horsepower to a selection of different chrome and leather shift knobs. Special Toyota Racing Development (TRD) high-performance items for the Scion tC include 18- and 19-inch wheels, a lowering kit, struts and shock absorbers, rear anti-roll bar, a high-performance clutch, a quick shifter, a stainless steel muffler, and a shift-point indicator light kit. Toyota's high-performance arm is already working on a 300-horsepower package of parts for the lunatic fringe.


esp the last sentence...

300-horsepower package will destroy the rsx-s

dont get me wrong, I love my RSX but that's pretty impressive :dontknow:

ombastic
07-06-2004, 12:10 AM
Yeah, well, type s w/ a few thousand put into it would eat tC for lunch. Have you seen turboed RSX w/ 300+ horsepower?

um..the price difference between the two would be significant also

shaggy
07-06-2004, 12:11 AM
um..the price difference between the two would be significant also


:iamwiths:

PapiTuyo326
07-08-2004, 03:52 PM
I wouldn't say that. I would pick tC over Camrys or Corollas any time. tC is pretty cool, I have to say, but then a lot of cars now are coming w/ more 'sporty' packages. I saw this car from Hyundai or Kia or something and it's as cheap as lower civic models but as well sport-equipped as base RSX.. tC is a good option for people considering base RSX. However, can't be compared to S. Type S's engine efficiency and output and the higher redline and iVTEC are a different breed that cars like tC would be hard to compare against. People keep saying 'if tC did this or that' but the truth will be that the vast majority of new tC owners will not go for supercharger or any kinda speed-minded mods, just like the vast majority of RSXs you see on the street are total stocks.

:iamwiths:

the car has been tested to do 15.8 in the 1320....not conna be spankin(or even hanging with) the type s at all unless it gets teh supercharger(4500) and that will bring it up to the type s's price range..

type s with intake and hondata can do low low low 14s

if you consider the tc over the type s for anything other than monetary reasons....you should have your head examined

that car will never outhandle a type s....the engineer that decided to put TWO heavy ass glass sunroofs on the highest part of the car needs to get kicked in the face :thumbsdow

SaCH
07-08-2004, 04:00 PM
The supercharged tC will take the type S stock. Start modding! :wavey:

SaCH
07-08-2004, 04:02 PM
and i'm pretty sure the S/C tC will get a following just like the type s.

Dr.Honda
07-08-2004, 05:35 PM
its a nice car...but would i buy one? No.

Its around 16500 with tax and everything. Well around there. And then a super charger is 4500 bucks. Strut package. Exhaust package. Lowering package. It all adds up. The damn TC will cost MORE than a type S with all that shit and will pretty much perform the same.

Plus 200 hp n/a > 200 hp turbo.

Also 6spd, lighter, etc etc.

Its a nice car but i wouldnt consider it as a car i would go about modding.

tech9
07-08-2004, 09:50 PM
no matter what you say bout the tC, it still owns us money-wise. its not a bad car, yeah 2.4L but still its not "horrible" and you gotta say it has the looks. yeah my rsx-s will fkn rape tC's lil ass but if sumone drops $6k into their tc, itll still be cheaper than rsx-s and faster than my car
so guess wat, we lose... :(

EternalBlue
07-08-2004, 09:56 PM
I think the TC is a super deal. Seems everyone is all over it. I paid $23900 OTD for my base auto with leather, OEM kit and fog lights. No one can say the TC isn't a good deal. I'd rather take one of those over a Civic LX or EX. Even the Mazda 3 spits out the same horses as my base AND it's a lot cheaper. I think Acura should have built our cars with more HP to be more competitive. At least 180 for the base and 220+ for the Type S. There is a lot of competition these days and most of the cars out there producing the same HP can be bought for a lot cheaper.

I still love Hondas though. Honda for life. ;)

crazy
07-09-2004, 09:41 AM
Its true the S/C has 200hp just like the RSX, but it gets 206tq....

The Scion is a good car, its a starter, you have the option of all of the TRD parts of aftermarket. However I still I like the RSX more.

watermelonman
07-09-2004, 10:48 AM
The morons at Scion/Toy aren't bringing them or any Scion's here :firemad: We get the Vitz instead. Oh yay.

Hah, that thing's engine barely makes enough power to overcome its own internal friction!

GTSPHREAK
07-09-2004, 02:09 PM
its a nice car...but would i buy one? No.

Its around 16500 with tax and everything. Well around there. And then a super charger is 4500 bucks. Strut package. Exhaust package. Lowering package. It all adds up. The damn TC will cost MORE than a type S with all that shit and will pretty much perform the same.

Plus 200 hp n/a > 200 hp turbo.

Also 6spd, lighter, etc etc.

Its a nice car but i wouldnt consider it as a car i would go about modding.


not really id much rather have a car that comes 200hpturbo then 200 n/a look at the old mr2's they came with 200hp but start modding them and man they fly, yeah u can turbo a na car but come on the s is meant for high reving not turbos. and before anyone gets me wrong i love high reving n/a cars nothing else sounds like it :thumbsup:

shaggy
07-09-2004, 02:35 PM
don't get me wrong car but when trd comes with the tc 300hp package it will eat the rsx for lunch....

I bet it'll only be mid 20's for it too

for 21k you can get the S/C with 200hp 206tq.... add the borla exhaust :love: 550.00 and say the aem intake 200.00(these will be apart of the 40 options) all factory warranty. your still under 22K

not to mention your rolling on 17's

If you get a good deal maybe you can get a stock type S for this price

aonsoKuDC5
07-09-2004, 03:10 PM
don't get me wrong car but when trd comes with the tc 300hp package it will eat the rsx for lunch....

I bet it'll only be mid 20's for it too

for 21k you can get the S/C with 200hp 206tq.... add the borla exhaust :love: 550.00 and say the aem intake 200.00(these will be apart of the 40 options) all factory warranty. your still under 22K

not to mention your rolling on 17's

If you get a good deal maybe you can get a stock type S for this price

where does it say it will come with 300hp?

as for the TC, i think it's a nice car for the price.

but you guys need to look at the transmission. that thing is a 5 speed manual OVERDRIVE. it's gears is probably as long as a 4speed automatic.

however for a car that is driven everyday, that thing is probably THE ONE. with all the options and entertainment features.

but for a more performance oriented car (NOT DRAG RACING YOU IDIOTS), hands down the rsx-s will take it.

shaggy
07-09-2004, 03:14 PM
where does it say it will come with 300hp?

as for the TC, i think it's a nice car for the price.

but you guys need to look at the transmission. that thing is a 5 speed manual OVERDRIVE. it's gears is probably as long as a 4speed automatic.

however for a car that is driven everyday, that thing is probably THE ONE. with all the options and entertainment features.

but for a more performance oriented car (NOT DRAG RACING YOU IDIOTS), hands down the rsx-s will take it.


If you read the bottom of page one...

Model Lineup

There are only two factory-installed options, the automatic transmission at $845 and the side and roof air bag system for $650. To make the car more palatable to more people, Scion has chosen a menu of 40 different freestanding options, more than any other car in its class, ranging from a $4500 supercharger kit good for 200 horsepower to a selection of different chrome and leather shift knobs. Special Toyota Racing Development (TRD) high-performance items for the Scion tC include 18- and 19-inch wheels, a lowering kit, struts and shock absorbers, rear anti-roll bar, a high-performance clutch, a quick shifter, a stainless steel muffler, and a shift-point indicator light kit. Toyota's high-performance arm is already working on a 300-horsepower package of parts for the lunatic fringe.

and I don't think you need to call people idiots..

EternalBlue
07-09-2004, 03:19 PM
and I don't think you need to call people idiots..

I agree.

Dr.Honda
07-09-2004, 06:45 PM
it may have 206 ft lbs but its heavier and a 5spd...im guessing it will have long gearing too.

Plus 200 hp NA > 200 hp FI

We discussed this in another thread...200 hp is more user friendly and is better for handling.

Not saying that the TC supercharged will be slow...but i dont think it would beat a S. It would be a good race i think.

AsadChinoy
07-09-2004, 07:48 PM
One problem Scion Tc drivers will experience is the tranmission. It is only offered in a 5 speed manual, while the Type S has a 6 speed manual. If the tranmission gearing in the Tc is anything like the gearing in the celica, the scion will have a hard time getting off the line. Just my $.02.

1fastrsx4u
07-09-2004, 11:37 PM
What's up with that? I raced a Type-S froma dead stop twice. The first time I lost,and the second time I won. Both times kept up pretty good with it. Both were stock. TC was auto and of course Type-S is 6-Speed man. My real question is...How the hell can this $17K TC keep up with the $23K Type-S, whcih is designed for speed. Doesn't matter if I won or lost any of the times. Why the hell did my car keep up if the RSX is so much better? :driving: :questionm :dontknow:

crazy
07-10-2004, 09:18 AM
Maybe he wasn't racing, or couldn't drive....

stillstock
07-10-2004, 11:09 AM
why don't we just wait to see official numbers and times and people's experiences before we say 'Tc sucks'....same story in comparison to the srt-4

you guys are nuts sometimes

i think its impressive that toyota has the confidence to build a cheap car with all the options and accessories avail

by the end of the year a person could spend 25k and get a scion with 19's, performance suspension and supercharger...with a warrantee
toyotas are cheap to own too...low maintenance costs...go to an acura dealeshihp...wow

aonsoKuDC5
07-10-2004, 02:59 PM
I agree.

umm sorry if i offended any drag racers. i was just saying it like a joking kind of manner.

idiots. :laughing:

aonsoKuDC5
07-10-2004, 03:08 PM
why don't we just wait to see official numbers and times and people's experiences before we say 'Tc sucks'....same story in comparison to the srt-4

you guys are nuts sometimes

i think its impressive that toyota has the confidence to build a cheap car with all the options and accessories avail

by the end of the year a person could spend 25k and get a scion with 19's, performance suspension and supercharger...with a warrantee
toyotas are cheap to own too...low maintenance costs...go to an acura dealeshihp...wow

yes i agree things are getting cheaper and more for the money.

but u have to understand, the rsx-s is designed back in the year 2000 and came out in 2001 as a 2002 model.

so you see the scion lineup is fairly new to the american market with tons of research of all the "sport compacts"

im afraid to say the rsx-s is falling behind in terms of practicality. but that's just the way the market will always work. car companies will either keep making cars better and for cheaper, or they'll start looking into another market like SUV's or family sedans.

right now since all the craze since the rice and the riciest came out, the "sport compact" industry made millions and millions and continues to grow. that's the main reason why scion even exists in the first place.

i give my thumbs up to the Sction TC (and in which one of my buddies is getting one next month) and it's a great car for the money as well as all the accesories and features.

but seriously, the rsx-s is obviously more performance oriented and not "sport-compact" oriented. and for god sake people, there's this word in the dictionary that nobody seems to ever understand. it's called "Balance"

the reason you don't see 300hp miatas is well because it will unbalanced. 200hp n/a fitted with a short ratio 6speed lightweight coupe. it was built to road race. designed to road race. yet 99% of people will drag race it or rice it out.

now that the TC is out, i hope people stop buying rsx-s's and start getting the TC's. cause i'd rather see a bunch of TC's with a bodykit roaming around then another rsx with a veilside kit.

okay im done. :spin:

mister x
07-11-2004, 03:05 AM
It's not a valid comparison, the TypeS is clearly in a class (and price range) above the tC. I drove the tC and it totally underwhelmed me. Yes it has 17" wheels but with the weight and soft suspension the handling was lukewarm. And the shifter, damn the throws were long. The TypeS has such a sweet trans and shifter compared to the tC. If you're performance oriented, the tC will NOT satisfy you, but you will have a reliable, comfortable, pleasant, daily driver at a good price.

JMBare
07-11-2004, 03:52 AM
did any of you actually read the article....

Scion has chosen a menu of 40 different freestanding options, more than any other car in its class, ranging from a $4500 supercharger kit good for 200 horsepower to a selection of different chrome and leather shift knobs. Special Toyota Racing Development (TRD) high-performance items for the Scion tC include 18- and 19-inch wheels, a lowering kit, struts and shock absorbers, rear anti-roll bar, a high-performance clutch, a quick shifter, a stainless steel muffler, and a shift-point indicator light kit. Toyota's high-performance arm is already working on a 300-horsepower package of parts for the lunatic fringe.


esp the last sentence...

300-horsepower package will destroy the rsx-s

dont get me wrong, I love my RSX but that's pretty impressive :dontknow:


The problem is, you are comparing the stock output of the Type-S, to the POTENTIAL output of the Scion!

Spend the kind of money it is going to take to get the Scion to 300 HP on your RSX, and they Scion will not even have a prayer.

Hell it takes a $4500 option just to get it to 200 Flywheel HP... Our car starts out there!!!

Plus, I think someone else pointed out the Tranny differences... The taller gearing in th TC will put it at a huge disadvantage!

My 2 cents!!!

-JMS

JMBare
07-11-2004, 03:57 AM
There is another post about the tc v. the base RSX. I'm not interested in that comparison, because I was never interested in the base RSX. For me, it was the Type S or nothing from Acura. The 6speed manual transmission was huge for me, and might well be the saving grace for Type S IMO. I went to the movies yesterday, and before the movie there was a commercial for the tc. It was very similar to the RSX commercial that is on tv, but the tc commercial was more futuristic and had annimation. I was struck with how good looking the tc was, and how solid the stance was. As far as I'm concerned, Toyota just did not make a car that I was into, except for the IS300 or Supra (I do not like the Celica or MR2 or any of the others) but those cars are out of my range. For me, Toyota seemed to make the right trucks, but not the right cars. Honda made the right car, the Type S. There are some things that I never liked about the Type S, like the wheels, and tiny rear windows, and super-small sunroof, and crappy speakers, and I do not think that the turning radius is as good as it should be. But there are plenty of things about the Type S that I love...and that is why it is my car. But seriously, look at this Scion tc, and look at the base price and how you can option it:
http://www.nctd.com/review-intro.cfm?Vehicle=2005_Scion_tC&ReviewID=1566
I'd be very surprised if Honda did not counter some of this with the '05 model, but the ability to factory customize the tc makes it a much more accessible car than the Type S. Look at the sunroof on that thing, and standard 17s with factory optional 18s or 19s, and a factory optional supercharger...heck, all of the TRD stuff. I'll be watching these cars carefully as they roll out over the next few months (they come out this week), and I might even go to a lot and drive one. Looks like real competition.

I actually do not like the look of the TC.. It looks way too tall.. I mean the amount of metal between the top of the front wheel wells and the top of the hood is huge... It make the car look "Uncomfortable" with it's stance? Does that make any sense?

-JMS

JMBare
07-11-2004, 04:00 AM
I think it is great that they came up with the concept of having more options in performance rather than just accessories. The motor is decent and the car looks great in my opinion and the price is just right for a starter. I think the RSX is a better car though. But for the prices, you can't beat the tc unless you want a geo or kia.

Personally I think the WHole concept of "Factory upgrade options" is just another way of nickle and dimming car owners to death.. If the factory recognizes that you will need to make changes to get the car to perform, than they obviously have purposely detuned it, with the only intention of selling us more crap that should have been OEM!

Sorry, I am rambling.. I am a little drunk right now!! LOL

-JMS

JMBare
07-11-2004, 04:02 AM
However, the torque on the supercharged Scion is 206. That's a considerable number.


The tourque on My dad's Dodge truck is huge!!! but it is still a pig, because it does not have any top end power... Like so many huge tourque motor, it falls on it's face once it really starts moving!!!

Sorry, still drunk...

-JMS

JMBare
07-11-2004, 04:05 AM
its all fun and games till you have to tell people you own a scion.....its not a lexus....its not even the lower toyota.....its the even lower scion.....you might as well just go gay and drive a pink volkswagen beetle


The best post I have read yet!!! LOL

-JMS

JMBare
07-11-2004, 04:06 AM
um..the price difference between the two would be significant also


Yeah, but when you are financing both, you are only talking about a couple dollars more per month for the RSX.. It is the out of pocket money that makes it go.. And this is the money you will feel the most!!!

-JMS

stillstock
07-12-2004, 09:39 AM
the new c&d has the scion test...they seemed to like it

for myself i like that its a heavier car and would ride a tad softer

i like the interior..looks lexus is300ish(not exactly but somewhat)
the panorama sunroof is a very nice touch for the price point
i like the exterior...very clean...
and as far as the ride/handling tradeoff...its probably the personality from a compact i'm looking for to be fun...but to handle the rough roads better than the rsx

i'd like to test drive a tc to see how it is..
only bad thing is i put like 31,000 miles in one year...so thats a big hit in depreciation...plus i still like the look of the acura alot...so its still not worth it for me to trade...esp for another sport compact
but maybe i'll drive it and change my mind...who knows

shaggy
07-12-2004, 11:32 AM
The problem is, you are comparing the stock output of the Type-S, to the POTENTIAL output of the Scion!

Spend the kind of money it is going to take to get the Scion to 300 HP on your RSX, and they Scion will not even have a prayer.

Hell it takes a $4500 option just to get it to 200 Flywheel HP... Our car starts out there!!!

Plus, I think someone else pointed out the Tranny differences... The taller gearing in th TC will put it at a huge disadvantage!

My 2 cents!!!

-JMS

hey JMS, glad to see you chime in on this subject, always enjoy your point of view.

Having said that, I just thought (and maybe I should just wait til I get all the facts) that for the price you can obtain a TC with 200hp and 206TQ for less than the stock type S. If they come out with a package deal for a 300hp TC it will still be considerably cheaper than an rsx. If you try to obtain the same amount of hp you will spend well over 30K. Trust me I know, I have spent thousands on my car to get the hp it has now. i could have bought an M3 for the amount of money I've spent. That was the only point I was trying to make.

but then again I guess I'm just an idiot drag racer :rolleyes:

JMBare
07-12-2004, 02:39 PM
but then again I guess I'm just an idiot drag racer :rolleyes:

Dude... Most of us are... This is the only sort of racing which comes with bragging rights!!!

Besides, i was Rocked when I responded to these!!! LOL

-JMS

aonsoKuDC5
07-12-2004, 04:31 PM
Dude... Most of us are... This is the only sort of racing which comes with bragging rights!!!

Besides, i was Rocked when I responded to these!!! LOL

-JMS

drag racing comes with bragging rights?

michael shumacher doesn't have bragging rights then.

crazy
07-12-2004, 04:44 PM
Most people don't drive Ferrari F1's.

And with drag racing you usually have a slip (if you do it on a track) but if you take your time from a track, it might be very fast but people who don't live near that track/know about it won't know how fast it is. I.E we know 12 secs is pretty fast. But if someone says "I ran a 1:08:4 at Joeschmoe Racetrack", you can't say if its fast or not.

Gary Waller
07-12-2004, 06:01 PM
i drove a scion tc... although it wasnt broken in it was a descent 0-60. Id compare it to a mini cooper (non S.) it had a great chirp into second but nothing in third. It had absolutely no pull in third. Nice interior though.

JMBare
07-12-2004, 07:43 PM
michael shumacher doesn't have bragging rights then.

Please let me know, the next time you and your buddies are hanging out with Michael Schumacher at the local tuner's hang out on a friday night!!!

I am talking about about YOU having the ability to brag!!!

-JMS

JMBare
07-12-2004, 07:47 PM
But if someone says "I ran a 1:08:4 at Joeschmoe Racetrack", you can't say if its fast or not.


Exactly!!! Besides, how often would you encounter a competition like this on the street anyway?

aonsoKuDC5
07-13-2004, 04:03 AM
oh well there's no use in trying to argue.

keep on drag racing, wow you guys have so much bragging rights. i can shift gears really really fast!!!

give me a break

crazy
07-13-2004, 08:27 AM
He was saying that no matter how fast of a road/auto-x'er you are, its hard to compare and brag about it to others because there's no standardized measurement.

aonsoKuDC5
07-13-2004, 03:57 PM
He was saying that no matter how fast of a road/auto-x'er you are, its hard to compare and brag about it to others because there's no standardized measurement.


yeah i understand. but a real racer doesn't need to brag, winning races automatically does it for you.

JMBare
07-14-2004, 01:55 AM
yeah i understand. but a real racer doesn't need to brag, winning races automatically does it for you.


Huh???

What world do you live in? Everything we do is all about bragging rights!!!

Why even race, if you are not being competitive? I don't get it!

Besides.. What good is your road racing skills going to do you at the red light on a Friday night? It's the road race guys who get killed most often... Some kid pushing it just a little too hard on some back road who ends up in a tree... Lights out!! The real fun is in whipping some cocky F-ers ass without him seeing it comming!! This is the rush that drives most of us to going faster. And oh yeah, drag racing is way more involved than shifting fast...

This is what I meant by bragging rights!!! One small victory after another...

See ya,
JMS

P.S. Save me the lectures about street racing, I have battled this one before...

aonsoKuDC5
07-14-2004, 04:44 AM
Huh???

What world do you live in? Everything we do is all about bragging rights!!!

Why even race, if you are not being competitive? I don't get it!

Besides.. What good is your road racing skills going to do you at the red light on a Friday night? It's the road race guys who get killed most often... Some kid pushing it just a little too hard on some back road who ends up in a tree... Lights out!! The real fun is in whipping some cocky F-ers ass without him seeing it comming!! This is the rush that drives most of us to going faster. And oh yeah, drag racing is way more involved than shifting fast...

This is what I meant by bragging rights!!! One small victory after another...

See ya,
JMS

P.S. Save me the lectures about street racing, I have battled this one before...

you see, your head is shoved so far up your drag racing ass, that you do not realize there is another world beyond the 1/4 mile.

sure you beat a car by a car length or something.

but try smoking a lotus v8 espirit at thunderhill running consistantly faster lap times. if i wanted to brag, then it'll mean more than any of your pathetic little 15 second drag races.

coachola
07-14-2004, 05:04 AM
you see, your head is shoved so far up your drag racing ass, that you do not realize there is another world beyond the 1/4 mile.

sure you beat a car by a car length or something.

but try smoking a lotus v8 espirit at thunderhill running consistantly faster lap times. if i wanted to brag, then it'll mean more than any of your pathetic little 15 second drag races.
As someone who's been involved in the road racing scene for awhile I'd say that both of you have validity in your points. JMShipp2, it's true about street bragging rights, that having a fast car really gets you noticed. However, that's not to say that good drivers out there don't pick up some reputability as well. For anyone who's been in a twisty race, as I have both on the streets and on the track, people HATE to lose, especially in superior cars, as Aonsoku points out. If you obliterate a faster, better handling car because you're a better driver, then it's quite satisfying, and there are bragging rights. Straight-line racing does take skill, but it's not nearly as big of a factor as in road-racing.

Despite this, I still have respect for people who build and modify their own cars, then take them out for challenges in drag. That involves time, effort, and knowledge. If you've got a lot of sweat invested in your car, and can beat lots of guys at the runs every weekend, then more power to you. Who I don't have respect for are people who pay an assload of money -except on a supercar like a Zonda ;)- for some shop to fix up their ride, then prance around like the master of the streets. That's where drag and road racing differ. A chimp driving a 10 sec. car can beat practically anything out on the street. On the track a humble Miata can smoke a 360 Modena because of driver skill.

aonsoKuDC5
07-14-2004, 05:07 AM
As someone who's been involved in the road racing scene for awhile I'd say that both of you have validity in your points. JMShipp2, it's true about street bragging rights, that having a fast car really gets you noticed. However, that's not to say that good drivers out there don't pick up some reputability as well. For anyone who's been in a twisty race, as I have both on the streets and on the track, people HATE to lose, especially in superior cars, as Aonsoku points out. If you obliterate a faster, better handling car because you're a better driver, then it's quite satisfying, and there are bragging rights. Straight-line racing does take skill, but it's not nearly as big of a factor as in road-racing.

Despite this, I still have respect for people who build and modify their own cars, then take them out for challenges in drag. That involves time, effort, and knowledge. If you've got a lot of sweat invested in your car, and can beat lots of guys at the runs every weekend, then more power to you. Who I don't have respect for are people who pay an assload of money -except on a supercar like a Zonda ;)- for some shop to fix up their ride, then prance around like the master of the streets. That's where drag and road racing differ. A chimp driving a 10 sec. car can beat practically anything out on the street. On the track a humble Miata can smoke a 360 Modena because of driver skill.

if only i had the cool temper as my good buddy in the evo. :laughing:

JMBare
07-14-2004, 02:50 PM
but try smoking a lotus v8 espirit at thunderhill running consistantly faster lap times. if i wanted to brag, then it'll mean more than any of your pathetic little 15 second drag races.


See, here is the problem...

I will never own a lotus esprit and personally do not know anyone with one... The likely hood of me encountering one, is also very rare... If I do, it is more than likely going to be at the light on Rt. 40... When I take him to the cleaners, when the light turns green, that is all the validation I, and most people, will need!

I read your signature, and have no idea how to apply your claims to the real world!!! I do not live on the west coast, and have no interest in racing my car in this manner.. If I were out to do so, I would probably have purchased a Lotus Elise(Spelling?), or an STI, or maybe even an EVO 8, or something else built for that purpose!!!

If you want to be a road racer, you bought the wrong car. Front engine, front wheel drive is definately not the correct platform for that... It is the Drag race indusry which thrusted Honda to the forefront... DEAL with it...

Also, I am a thirty year old male who has built several successful cars over the last ten years... I even attended the races here in DC a few years back, and though it was pretty cool to see the Cadillac, and Corvette supercars, go round and round, I have to tell you... The street class cars were boring as hell.. Most of them were gutted unibodies with damn near stock engines, and stiff, though highly tuned, suspensions, that could never have been driven on the streets.

In fact.. I rode in the Skunk 2 Road road race Si around the track during the opening parade lap, sitting on the electronics on the passenger side... So what!!! After a lap or two into the race, eveyone was ready to go walk around the pits to see the static cars!!! That shit was just plain boring! Rare is it, that I see the same excitement built around the road race events, as I see a Import Drag race events. This is a reflection of what this country thinks of road racing!!! Sure it may be exciting to actually drive one of those cars, but most people who are racing enthusiasts, just don't care about them!

Anyway... I am done with this one... Have fun when you run your car over the side of a canyon somewhere, because you had to go just a little bit faster through that last turn!!! I will be busy picking up the ladies at the local hang out, while talking about the kid who killed himself last weekend on blank rooad, after he ran of into the woods and wrapped himself around the tree!!! Hell it may even be his girl I am talking to! :thumbsup:

This reminds me of the debate with _____ , who swore he had to get the Yamaha R6, because it handled slightly better through the turns, but when he and I rode together, My R1 would walk him everytime!!! Eventually, he abandoned his R6, because It is the straight line acceleration which delivers the real rush.

Have fun,
JMS

mister x
07-14-2004, 02:55 PM
...A chimp driving a 10 sec. car can beat practically anything out on the street.

LOL at that image. Yep, lotta chimps out there driving 10 sec. cars AND Modenas, lotta pigs and donkeys too. If you look beyond the superficial though, there's much to appreciate in all forms of racing, 1/4 to Cannonball Run, 50 yard dash to marathon. I give props to anybody who safely races, sucessful or not. Racing is a metaphor for life.

aonsoKuDC5
07-14-2004, 04:17 PM
See, here is the problem...

I will never own a lotus esprit and personally do not know anyone with one... The likely hood of me encountering one, is also very rare... If I do, it is more than likely going to be at the light on Rt. 40... When I take him to the cleaners, when the light turns green, that is all the validation I, and most people, will need!

I read your signature, and have no idea how to apply your claims to the real world!!! I do not live on the west coast, and have no interest in racing my car in this manner.. If I were out to do so, I would probably have purchased a Lotus Elise(Spelling?), or an STI, or maybe even an EVO 8, or something else built for that purpose!!!

If you want to be a road racer, you bought the wrong car. Front engine, front wheel drive is definately not the correct platform for that... It is the Drag race indusry which thrusted Honda to the forefront... DEAL with it...

Also, I am a thirty year old male who has built several successful cars over the last ten years... I even attended the races here in DC a few years back, and though it was pretty cool to see the Cadillac, and Corvette supercars, go round and round, I have to tell you... The street class cars were boring as hell.. Most of them were gutted unibodies with damn near stock engines, and stiff, though highly tuned, suspensions, that could never have been driven on the streets.

In fact.. I rode in the Skunk 2 Road road race Si around the track during the opening parade lap, sitting on the electronics on the passenger side... So what!!! After a lap or two into the race, eveyone was ready to go walk around the pits to see the static cars!!! That shit was just plain boring! Rare is it, that I see the same excitement built around the road race events, as I see a Import Drag race events. This is a reflection of what this country thinks of road racing!!! Sure it may be exciting to actually drive one of those cars, but most people who are racing enthusiasts, just don't care about them!

Anyway... I am done with this one... Have fun when you run your car over the side of a canyon somewhere, because you had to go just a little bit faster through that last turn!!! I will be busy picking up the ladies at the local hang out, while talking about the kid who killed himself last weekend on blank rooad, after he ran of into the woods and wrapped himself around the tree!!! Hell it may even be his girl I am talking to! :thumbsup:

This reminds me of the debate with _____ , who swore he had to get the Yamaha R6, because it handled slightly better through the turns, but when he and I rode together, My R1 would walk him everytime!!! Eventually, he abandoned his R6, because It is the straight line acceleration which delivers the real rush.

Have fun,
JMS


bwahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahaha

there is nothing more that i need to say than the fact that you are a thirty year old male with a 16 year old's brain. "FWD honda with the vtach are great for drag racing for bragging rights!"

aonsoKuDC5
07-14-2004, 04:20 PM
LOL at that image. Yep, lotta chimps out there driving 10 sec. cars AND Modenas, lotta pigs and donkeys too. If you look beyond the superficial though, there's much to appreciate in all forms of racing, 1/4 to Cannonball Run, 50 yard dash to marathon. I give props to anybody who safely races, sucessful or not. Racing is a metaphor for life.

you don't get the point, it is a metaphor.

meaning almost anybody can drive a 10 second car and beat a lot of other cars out there even if it's not at full potential.

but yes there are a lot of 360 modenas, F355s, porsches, with the occaisional lamborghini, full tuned s2000's, NSX's, corvette z06's at the open track sessions. infact it is a regular thing. so i suggest jmshipp sticks with hanging out with the civic hatchbacks and integras, while im tossing it up at infineon raceway chasing a NSX.

JMBare
07-14-2004, 06:36 PM
bwahahahahaahahahahahahaahahahahahahaha

there is nothing more that i need to say than the fact that you are a thirty year old male with a 16 year old's brain.

Do a search on my user name ass.. There are many around here that would totally disagree with you!!!

What contributions have you made lately?

Also, why would you get personal? Is it because you are able to hind behind the anonymity of the internet?

Pussy!!!


"FWD honda with the vtach

vtach? What the f**k is that? Idiot!

"are great for drag racing for bragging rights!"

There are several FWD races in the eights right now, with built unibodies!!! Need I list them for you?

Finally, unlike you, I did not purchase an RSX, setting out to build the ultimate racecar!!! I bought an inexspensive sport compact which is easy to build into the low twelve secound range, for less money than the cost of a stock EVO, or STI... This is all I need...

-JMS

mister x
07-14-2004, 08:56 PM
you don't get the point, it is a metaphor.

I did get it, and it's funny. I just took off on it in referring to pigs (attention hogs, you know, guys with slow cars but loud exhausts) and donkeys (dummies racing on crowded streets).

crazy
07-14-2004, 09:32 PM
Keep it friendly, guys :)

coachola
07-15-2004, 02:12 AM
I agree with Mister X. Props to anyone who safely races in any capacity. Pretty much if successful in any form of racing, there is something to be said about you. Aonsoku, lol man, be cool out there. While I personally favor road racing over the streets and drag, it's really all about having fun in motorsports. What I have a problem with is attitude. This is where people think that they're the sh*t when they're not. Such an example would be someone who has no clue how to work on cars, or how to drive, but has a massive bankroll and thinks they're special. Oftentimes my fellow road-racers also get irritated when streeters talk smack because "they know they have more skill."

Where I think Aonsoku is coming from is that in his opinion road racing is the highest form of racing because it requires a great deal of skill to be proficient at. He seems to dislike opinions which do not put much stake in it as opposed to drag. JMShipp2 is 100% correct when it comes to bragging rights tho, as many streeters and drag racers simply do not care how good of a driver you are on the track when it comes down to a stoplight. IMHO, if you beat someone in a race through the twisties, then you can boast a great deal about your performance, but only to a smaller group of people. This is because, simply put, the majority drag races, and couldn't care less about any other form of racing.

JMBare
07-15-2004, 08:23 AM
I agree with Mister X. Props to anyone who safely races in any capacity. Pretty much if successful in any form of racing, there is something to be said about you. Aonsoku, lol man, be cool out there. While I personally favor road racing over the streets and drag, it's really all about having fun in motorsports. What I have a problem with is attitude. This is where people think that they're the sh*t when they're not. Such an example would be someone who has no clue how to work on cars, or how to drive, but has a massive bankroll and thinks they're special. Oftentimes my fellow road-racers also get irritated when streeters talk smack because "they know they have more skill."

Where I think Aonsoku is coming from is that in his opinion road racing is the highest form of racing because it requires a great deal of skill to be proficient at. He seems to dislike opinions which do not put much stake in it as opposed to drag. JMShipp2 is 100% correct when it comes to bragging rights tho, as many streeters and drag racers simply do not care how good of a driver you are on the track when it comes down to a stoplight. IMHO, if you beat someone in a race through the twisties, then you can boast a great deal about your performance, but only to a smaller group of people. This is because, simply put, the majority drag races, and couldn't care less about any other form of racing.

Well said!!!

-JMS

Murlo26
07-15-2004, 10:31 AM
i saw jmshipp post in the guardian thread that he got in a brawl in the vs forum so i had to see it. I believe both of you have valid points and i love to do both kinds of racing and have equal respect for both kinds. BUt honestly, drag racing is way harder than u say it is aonsokudc5. In drag if you mess up at all you are done. You cannot make mistakes, you have to be perfect. IN road racing you have laps to make up for mistakes, it is way more forgiving then drag. So dont talk smack about drag drivers, seeing as there are probably plenty of drag drivers that would put a whooping on u in road racing too.

Not trying to be an ass, just dont shit on other peoples racing when you dont do it, if you did both i would be more understanding, still would argue, but comon drag isnt easy, especially being good at drag in FWD cars. This poses a real challenge. In fact now that i think about it i would say that drag in FWD is a lot harder to be good at then road in FWD, cause RSX's are more of a road car. Peace out. NO hard feelings, just my opinoin.

stillstock
07-15-2004, 11:18 AM
i saw jmshipp post in the guardian thread that he got in a brawl in the vs forum so i had to see it. I believe both of you have valid points and i love to do both kinds of racing and have equal respect for both kinds. BUt honestly, drag racing is way harder than u say it is aonsokudc5. In drag if you mess up at all you are done. You cannot make mistakes, you have to be perfect. IN road racing you have laps to make up for mistakes, it is way more forgiving then drag. So dont talk smack about drag drivers, seeing as there are probably plenty of drag drivers that would put a whooping on u in road racing too.

Not trying to be an ass, just dont shit on other peoples racing when you dont do it, if you did both i would be more understanding, still would argue, but comon drag isnt easy, especially being good at drag in FWD cars. This poses a real challenge. In fact now that i think about it i would say that drag in FWD is a lot harder to be good at then road in FWD, cause RSX's are more of a road car. Peace out. NO hard feelings, just my opinoin.

drag racing you do have to be perfect...automatic here helps
road racing you do have to be perfect to some degree...especially against drivers like schulmacher and the ferrari team

the rsx has its own problems in drag and road...its suspension is pretty bad...honda really layed down a bunt with the machpherson...in the whole ride/handling compromise...their double wishbones are better balanced and have traction superiorities

Murlo26
07-15-2004, 11:42 AM
drag racing you do have to be perfect...automatic here helps
road racing you do have to be perfect to some degree...especially against drivers like schulmacher and the ferrari team

the rsx has its own problems in drag and road...its suspension is pretty bad...honda really layed down a bunt with the machpherson...in the whole ride/handling compromise...their double wishbones are better balanced and have traction superiorities

what i am trying to say is that in drag, if you mess up the launch or misshift once you lose the race, in a sense you have to be perfect.

I am not talking about keeping up with a ferrari or Schulmacher, i am talking about road racing in general. If you mess up a little or take a turn too wide you can recover, its not like if you take a turn too wide you quit the race you keep going for the rest of the laps. I am trying to say that road racing is more forgiving than drag considering you have a way longer time to do it. I do not disagree that to keep up with the things you mentioned that you have to be perfect but that is not the point.

Murlo26
07-15-2004, 11:44 AM
sorry stillstock i thought you said you do not have to be perfect in drag and that you have to be perfect in road, thought you were completely disagreeing with me, i am tired today, so sorry. But my comments stand for anyone who tries to disagree. I dont see how you could because it is common sense but feel free to argue that is what this board is for.

EternalBlue
07-15-2004, 12:38 PM
Keep it friendly, guys :)

:iamwiths: Do we really need to be calling each other names? :rolleyes:

JMBare
07-15-2004, 12:53 PM
the rsx has its own problems in drag and road...its suspension is pretty bad...honda really layed down a bunt with the machpherson...in the whole ride/handling compromise...their double wishbones are better balanced and have traction superiorities


Has anyone else felt a little unsettled with the toe in the rear suspension adds, when you are in a corner, hit a bump, temporarily unloading the suspension, then suddenly the car starts to waggle a bit...

It is a really unsettling feeling to feel your rear end suddenly start to "Steer" because you hit a bump...

I talked with factory reps about it... I was informed that Honda designed the rear end of the car to toe in under breaking force, so when the car dives it and lightens up the rear, it remains more stable and in a straight line...

-JMS

JMBare
07-15-2004, 12:54 PM
:iamwiths: Do we really need to be calling each other names? :rolleyes:


Sorry, He pissed me off!!!

I certainly am not in that habbit.

-JMS

EternalBlue
07-15-2004, 12:59 PM
Sorry, He pissed me off!!!

I certainly am not in that habbit.

-JMS

That's fine, just try to avoid it...that's not just directed at you...it goes for everyone. Let's be civil. :)

shaggy
07-15-2004, 03:03 PM
Not to mention this thread is about the new TC vs the type S....

It isn't about road race vs drag.....


aonsoKuDC5, should express his OPINION in another thread....

coachola
07-16-2004, 04:01 AM
Not to mention this thread is about the new TC vs the type S....

It isn't about road race vs drag.....


aonsoKuDC5, should express his OPINION in another thread....
Don't you just love post hijackers? :spin:

TeK
07-16-2004, 10:14 AM
:iamwiths:

the car has been tested to do 15.8 in the 1320....not conna be spankin(or even hanging with) the type s at all unless it gets teh supercharger(4500) and that will bring it up to the type s's price range..

type s with intake and hondata can do low low low 14s

if you consider the tc over the type s for anything other than monetary reasons....you should have your head examined

that car will never outhandle a type s....the engineer that decided to put TWO heavy ass glass sunroofs on the highest part of the car needs to get kicked in the face :thumbsdow


it doesnt sound right for the tC to get a 15.8 with only 160hp... the car is 2900+ pounds!!! even if it is super charged i dont think it will still beat the rsx-s in the 1320... just because of the fact that its heavier!

shaggy
07-16-2004, 10:40 AM
it doesnt sound right for the tC to get a 15.8 with only 160hp... the car is 2900+ pounds!!! even if it is super charged i dont think it will still beat the rsx-s in the 1320... just because of the fact that its heavier!


nice avatar....

be prepared to have ir removed....mine was and it was far less racy than that.....

stillstock
07-16-2004, 11:37 AM
it doesnt sound right for the tC to get a 15.8 with only 160hp... the car is 2900+ pounds!!! even if it is super charged i dont think it will still beat the rsx-s in the 1320... just because of the fact that its heavier!

does anyone on this board know what torque is...oh wait this is a honda board...i forgot

JMBare
07-16-2004, 02:07 PM
nice avatar....

be prepared to have ir removed....mine was and it was far less racy than that.....


Yeah dude... She is definately hot!!!

-JMS

EternalBlue
07-16-2004, 02:21 PM
PM sent! :)

aonsoKuDC5
07-16-2004, 02:26 PM
i saw jmshipp post in the guardian thread that he got in a brawl in the vs forum so i had to see it. I believe both of you have valid points and i love to do both kinds of racing and have equal respect for both kinds. BUt honestly, drag racing is way harder than u say it is aonsokudc5. In drag if you mess up at all you are done. You cannot make mistakes, you have to be perfect. IN road racing you have laps to make up for mistakes, it is way more forgiving then drag. So dont talk smack about drag drivers, seeing as there are probably plenty of drag drivers that would put a whooping on u in road racing too.

Not trying to be an ass, just dont shit on other peoples racing when you dont do it, if you did both i would be more understanding, still would argue, but comon drag isnt easy, especially being good at drag in FWD cars. This poses a real challenge. In fact now that i think about it i would say that drag in FWD is a lot harder to be good at then road in FWD, cause RSX's are more of a road car. Peace out. NO hard feelings, just my opinoin.

you see i used to be one of those drag racers. i just moved up in the form of racing to a higher level. infact drag racing was something i did when i was 16 years old and didn't know there was a whole nother world out there.

and if i really wanted to be a true drag racer still, i'd get myself a svt cobra or a camaro SS. or hell i'd even build and old school muscle car with a 454 and hand down an rsx's ass anyday in drag racing. but that's not the point.

so i came to the understanding that my rsx is meant for something else. and no jsmshipp i am not looking to build it for the ultimate road racing car. i find it to be a very good balanced car. right now it does low 14s high 13s in the 1/4 mile acceleration test, and soon enough im gonna record down some more lap times. (as soon as i have time to hit another open track event)

and to everybody else i got out of line here and i apologize. there's just something about when i work so hard to get to where im at, and then some other people find ways to insult me, i'll get very upset.

aonsoKuDC5
07-16-2004, 02:27 PM
and back to the topic about the TC, my friend is getting his in 2 weeks. so test drive and pics coming soon!

RSXType S
07-16-2004, 02:40 PM
How come this thread has been going on for so long?

shaggy
07-16-2004, 03:03 PM
PM sent! :)


owned:

shaggy
07-16-2004, 03:05 PM
you see i used to be one of those drag racers. i just moved up in the form of racing to a higher level. infact drag racing was something i did when i was 16 years old and didn't know there was a whole nother world out there.

and if i really wanted to be a true drag racer still, i'd get myself a svt cobra or a camaro SS. or hell i'd even build and old school muscle car with a 454 and hand down an rsx's ass anyday in drag racing. but that's not the point.

so i came to the understanding that my rsx is meant for something else. and no jsmshipp i am not looking to build it for the ultimate road racing car. i find it to be a very good balanced car. right now it does low 14s high 13s in the 1/4 mile acceleration test, and soon enough im gonna record down some more lap times. (as soon as i have time to hit another open track event)

and to everybody else i got out of line here and i apologize. there's just something about when i work so hard to get to where im at, and then some other people find ways to insult me, i'll get very upset.

your opinion has been noted....

can we get back to topic....

Murlo26
07-19-2004, 09:13 AM
you see i used to be one of those drag racers. i just moved up in the form of racing to a higher level. infact drag racing was something i did when i was 16 years old and didn't know there was a whole nother world out there.

and if i really wanted to be a true drag racer still, i'd get myself a svt cobra or a camaro SS. or hell i'd even build and old school muscle car with a 454 and hand down an rsx's ass anyday in drag racing. but that's not the point.

so i came to the understanding that my rsx is meant for something else. and no jsmshipp i am not looking to build it for the ultimate road racing car. i find it to be a very good balanced car. right now it does low 14s high 13s in the 1/4 mile acceleration test, and soon enough im gonna record down some more lap times. (as soon as i have time to hit another open track event)

and to everybody else i got out of line here and i apologize. there's just something about when i work so hard to get to where im at, and then some other people find ways to insult me, i'll get very upset.

i would reply to this but apparently people are getting a little upset as to the off topic issues. so i will refrain from saying any more except for the fact i know the rsx isnt a drag car i wasnt saying that, i have a 70 454 chevelle ss and i know what cars are meant for straight lining, im just saying that the 1/4 isnt as easy as you say.

On topic i believe the tc to be a real nice looking car. i also saw the ad before the movie(spiderman 2 i believe) and it looked sweet. I think that it will indeed be some competition for the rsx. I went to the scion website and did the build you car option. It came out cheaper than the type s by like 3 grand and that was with everything i could want and then some. And with the supercharger it would probably be even with the type s. So i would say give it a chance. Still dont like it as much as the s but it looks to be a good car.

aonsoKuDC5
07-21-2004, 05:08 PM
yeah i am not going to speak of anything off topic again.

but i went to check out the TC in person, and i'd have to say. for $16,000 this car is beautiful! i automatically fell in love with it. the interior is also very nice and the shifter is almost as smooth as an rsx. the headlights is also what got me, very sleek looking similar to a 7 series bmw. long hood, buff looking body, i like it! the only thing is that the car is so big looking, the 17" wheels don't do justice. it makes the 17s look more like 15s. so i think 18s or above is in order for the car to look balanced.

but otherwise i think everybody should consider buying a TC because for $16,000... that's extremely hard to beat.

shaggy
07-21-2004, 05:14 PM
So you would recommend this, eh?

I need to go test drive one

thanks for your input....

DesertSilverRSX-S
07-26-2004, 03:48 PM
So you would recommend this, eh?

I need to go test drive one

thanks for your input....

Its nice!! I puchased one. Should be coming in hopefully in the next week or two. The TC will become my daily driver. Too many miles on the Rsx. haha

mister x
07-26-2004, 08:36 PM
Its nice!! I puchased one. Should be coming in hopefully in the next week or two. The TC will become my daily driver. Too many miles on the Rsx. haha

Cool, let us know how the "social space" feature works out with the fold flat front and reclining back seats. Maybe some of the professional models you met will help you test it out.

albertu
07-26-2004, 10:32 PM
Yeah, well, type s w/ a few thousand put into it would eat tC for lunch. Have you seen turboed RSX w/ 300+ horsepower?
I think a stock Porsche 996 would eat both the RSX-s and tC for breakfast. ;)

06RSXS
07-17-2006, 01:09 PM
i wouldnt talk so bad about the scions. My girlfriend just bought an 06, i am actually pretty impressed. Rides and drives nice, decent power and handleing. And for under 17K how can you complain? Good reliable car with some cool options and made by a good manufacture.

ombastic
07-17-2006, 02:03 PM
i wouldnt talk so bad about the scions. My girlfriend just bought an 06, i am actually pretty impressed. Rides and drives nice, decent power and handleing. And for under 17K how can you complain? Good reliable car with some cool options and made by a good manufacture.
omg this was 2 yrs old

06RSXS
07-17-2006, 02:55 PM
ha... i didnt even realize that

Sweetnessinfall
07-17-2006, 08:27 PM
yeah man...two year old thread. ftl.

ombastic
07-17-2006, 09:34 PM
ha... i didnt even realize that
yeah and two years later. we already determined than the tC is better than the RSX. that is why they discontinued the RSX.

Fantasy04RSX
07-17-2006, 11:27 PM
fuck TC!!
opps/./
i mean, automatic tc, hahah, i lose to my friends manual TC

cbuck
07-18-2006, 02:41 AM
so it turns out the tC is faster/better than an rsx??? that really sucks balls if that's true.

Sweetnessinfall
07-18-2006, 10:53 AM
so it turns out the tC is faster/better than an rsx??? that really sucks balls if that's true.
it's true because the tC comes with 100 more ponies OTD and it only costs 16,000. which in comparison means you're buying an srt-4 when you buy a tc.:eek:

theporschephile
07-18-2006, 11:13 AM
it's true because the tC comes with 100 more ponies OTD and it only costs 16,000. which in comparison means you're buying an srt-4 when you buy a tc.:eek:
100 more hp? wtf are you smoking?

the tC is rated at 160hp (158ft-lbs). the supercharged one (which is a dealer option, not a factory option) is 200hp 201 ft-lbs iirc. either way you look at it, the biggest difference is 60hp and about 60ft-lbs...not 100

and the supercharged one is just over 20k, the base is 16k, but that's only 160hp

Sweetnessinfall
07-18-2006, 12:40 PM
100 more hp? wtf are you smoking?

the tC is rated at 160hp (158ft-lbs). the supercharged one (which is a dealer option, not a factory option) is 200hp 201 ft-lbs iirc. either way you look at it, the biggest difference is 60hp and about 60ft-lbs...not 100

and the supercharged one is just over 20k, the base is 16k, but that's only 160hp
:shakehead @ people who can't sense sarcasm.

Sweetnessinfall
07-18-2006, 12:42 PM
notice what the guy before me posted? :laughing:

Aco512
07-18-2006, 12:45 PM
lol, i thought you guys were serious also
:shakehead at myself

jeffrs82
07-18-2006, 01:01 PM
my buddies have tc's, i drive them once in a while, and thy also drive my type s, tc has more torque but all of them say the rsx is more fun to drive, the tc is too laid back on the road. just my opinion. :-)

jdmpwr07
07-18-2006, 01:10 PM
wtf is this even a question?

type s = trd tC...type s > manual tC...manual tC = base rsx 5spd...manual tC > base auto rsx...base auto rsx = auto tC...srt-4 > all

PUREVIL
07-18-2006, 02:53 PM
I work at a Toyota Dodge Scion on dealer, I sell these cars. They is no comperison to the Type S with the Scion TC. It is a cheaper car with not even half the aftermarket support. Dont get me wrong but these cars have alot of work to do, when it comes to the actual drivetrain to be a performer against a car like the Type S. But heck what do i know i only drive and sell the TC's everyday.

Sweetnessinfall
07-18-2006, 04:06 PM
wtf is this even a question?

type s = trd tC...type s > manual tC...manual tC = base rsx 5spd...manual tC > base auto rsx...base auto rsx = auto tC...srt-4 > all
:stfu:

cbuck
07-18-2006, 08:03 PM
:iamwiths: :laughing:

PUREVIL
07-18-2006, 10:52 PM
I work at a Toyota Dodge Scion on dealer, I sell these cars. They is no comperison to the Type S with the Scion TC. It is a cheaper car with not even half the aftermarket support. Dont get me wrong but these cars have alot of work to do, when it comes to the actual drivetrain to be a performer against a car like the Type S. But heck what do i know i only drive and sell the TC's everyday.


OR this! I drive them everyday.. no need posting test drives or pictures guys, nothing special. dont sweat it.. Scion/Toyota has alot of work to do b4 they can step up and work a Type S.:thumbsup:

cbuck
07-19-2006, 11:09 PM
sounds fantastic

PUREVIL
07-19-2006, 11:12 PM
sounds fantastic


what does?? I drive a TC as a Demo car everyday... Nothing special i think of it getting me from A to B it doesnt really drive me to modify, like my Type S does. really.

But driving it as a demo with paid gas and a car i dont need to worry about that so its great!

But as a performer twards the type s, again good luck ha ha... The TC is in the driveway and the Type S is in the garage take it as you may.

EDIT* half the parts for scion arnt even in stock or able to order.. and with that said it takes tons of cash to even match the performance with the TC to step up with the Type S, STOCK.

ombastic
07-19-2006, 11:39 PM
it takes tons of cash to even match the performance with the TC to step up with the Type S, STOCK.
no it doesn't.............

Fantasy04RSX
07-19-2006, 11:40 PM
wtf is this even a question?

type s = trd tC...type s > manual tC...manual tC = base rsx 5spd...manual tC > base auto rsx...base auto rsx = auto tC...srt-4 > all

auto RSX smokes auto TC dude, i tried, worked!!~:thumbsup:

Hammerhead i-Eagle Thrust
07-20-2006, 10:26 AM
doubt that

they both run mid 16s ftl

aonsoKuDC5
07-20-2006, 11:17 AM
what the, this thread is back from the dead i see.

damn people are still trying to compare the two?

all i can say is who the hell wants something that drives like a buick lacrosse? (TC)

umm, actually scratch that. the buick lacrosse feels more sportier than a TC. :D

Hammerhead i-Eagle Thrust
07-20-2006, 11:19 AM
yeah when i had my se-r. automatic base se-r...not a spec v. i drove a tc and then got back in my se-r and the se-r felt so much more sporty and responsive then the tc

PUREVIL
07-20-2006, 11:19 AM
no it doesn't.............

Im not gonna beat this topic to death, its pointless.

cbuck
07-24-2006, 11:50 PM
purevil, i meant that it sounded fantastic that the tc sucked compared the the rsx.

Hammerhead i-Eagle Thrust
07-25-2006, 09:06 AM
tc is a parts bin car

it has a lot to offer for the price, but it was built with the intention of being affordable, reliable and somewhat sporty, but its not the type of car that would excite someone who enjoys to drive. for people who arent that into cars its a great car

aonsoKuDC5
07-25-2006, 01:22 PM
tc is a parts bin car

it has a lot to offer for the price, but it was built with the intention of being affordable, reliable and somewhat sporty, but its not the type of car that would excite someone who enjoys to drive. for people who arent that into cars its a great car

yeah TC is a great car for posers

Hammerhead i-Eagle Thrust
07-25-2006, 01:55 PM
lol i guess...but since no one is really impressed with it anymore that doesnt work too well, the engine has a lot of potential though

03DSM-RSX
07-25-2006, 01:58 PM
^their lack of proper EMS holds them back.

also, most of the companies making products for them are not very knowledgeable about anything. they just make shitty parts and the scion owners buy like water. most scion owners dont know jack shit about their car and will believe anything any company says.

senseiturtle
07-25-2006, 02:31 PM
most scion owners dont know jack shit about their car and will believe anything any company says.

Unfortunatley, this is the case, as with any less-expensive sport compact.

To the guy who said tC's are miles behind RSX's.... No, they're not. Granted, the typeS is more suited for this type of thing, but I've been nothing but happy with my tC, and managed to suprise a few people both at the drag strip and through the cones.

With just a header, I ran the time in my sig. It goes to a video if you like. With that single mod, I'm running nearly the same E.T.'s as the bottom 30% of RSX-S drivers. The 2AZ is an extremely "bottled-up" motor, having 2 catalytic converters, an FE (read "shit") head, and exhaust piping that thins to 1.5 inches or so in a number of spots. I/H/full exhaust can increase the wheel HP to nearly the stock flywheel outputs (160/160) and be good for solid 14's.

This motor's saving grace comes from 2 areas. Torque, and gear ratios. The torque curve is very fat all the way through, with 95% of peak torque available from 3000-5500 rpms. The gear ratios in 1-2-3 are even shorter than an EP3. In the end, not all that awesome for drag racing, but it pulls like hell coming out of a sharp corner without shifting down to 1st gear. Stock wheels can support 225 tires for the added ease of max'ing out the width in a class.

I just want to say my peace... the tC is not "better" than a typeS, but I guarantee it isn't dog-shit slow as most of the magazine racers here make it out to be. I actually CHOSE the tC over the RSX-S because of insurance, gas (87 oct), intial cost, reliability (same camry motor since early 90s), and asthetic reasons. It is certainly not a bad car. But like the RSX-S, it has its flaws, and was originally designed for a different goal.

If toyota wanted to make a fast sports car, they would. Done it before, and will probably do it again. If you have any actual questions from a tC owner who likes to think he knows what the fuck he's talking about, ask away. I'll even be happy to let you drive mine if you're ever in BR. Form your opinions then.

kurdtkobain87
07-25-2006, 02:35 PM
i like the tc a lot. but it seems like reliability in some respects goes out the window. the interior of my friends tc is completely falling apart.

senseiturtle
07-25-2006, 02:37 PM
i like the tc a lot. but it seems like reliability in some respects goes out the window. the interior of my friends tc is completely falling apart.

How so ? Perhaps I can help.

theporschephile
07-25-2006, 04:04 PM
actually, the 2AZ wasn't used in the camry until 2002. The gen 4's retained the 5sfe motor.

I believe it was in the RAV4 since before that though, 2000 or so.

c0ldfyr3
07-25-2006, 04:09 PM
Anybody ever hear of sciontific?? Some scion club went to LACR and one of the TC members asked me to race. I laughed to myself and then we lined up. His car had ALOT of shit done to it but it wasnt even a race. GG scion!!

senseiturtle
07-25-2006, 07:17 PM
Anybody ever hear of sciontific?? Some scion club went to LACR and one of the TC members asked me to race. I laughed to myself and then we lined up. His car had ALOT of shit done to it but it wasnt even a race. GG scion!!


You're not exactly stock, either.

senseiturtle
07-25-2006, 07:18 PM
actually, the 2AZ wasn't used in the camry until 2002. The gen 4's retained the 5sfe motor.

I believe it was in the RAV4 since before that though, 2000 or so.


Thanks :) Didn't know that.

RSXtypeSex
12-26-2007, 03:42 AM
I have had a 2006 Scion TC for the last 6 months, it looks AMAZING, lowered, spoiler,lip rims, hids, ect.

BUT,
it feels like a freaking family car compared to my 2002 type S, which I'm getting on the road as soon as I sell the TC

the TC is a great starter car, for a newer driver,

one MAJOR problem with the TC

in 5th great, at 80mph you are at 4000RPM, on an engine that revs to 6200!

thats HORRIBLE, thats like being at 6000rpms in 6th gear on the type S
unthinkable.


pics of the baby. http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/Goreslinger/TC/none010.jpg
<br>
http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/Goreslinger/TC/none009.jpg<br>http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/Goreslinger/TC/none008.jpg
<br>http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/Goreslinger/TC/none012.jpg

Game
12-26-2007, 06:01 AM
That red TC logo looks awful.

Flip One
12-26-2007, 06:15 AM
Holy Fawkin' 2004 thread Batman

Game
12-26-2007, 06:19 AM
Holy Fawkin' 2004 thread Batman

lol damn didn't even notice that.

XXXdc5
12-29-2007, 05:49 AM
holy crap this is ridiculous old. yeah lose the TC its not doin anything good for you lol

killertofupanda
12-29-2007, 06:10 AM
I have had a 2006 Scion TC for the last 6 months, it looks AMAZING, lowered, spoiler,lip rims, hids, ect.

BUT,
it feels like a freaking family car compared to my 2002 type S, which I'm getting on the road as soon as I sell the TC

the TC is a great starter car, for a newer driver,

one MAJOR problem with the TC

in 5th great, at 80mph you are at 4000RPM, on an engine that revs to 6200!

thats HORRIBLE, thats like being at 6000rpms in 6th gear on the type S
unthinkable.


pics of the baby. http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/Goreslinger/TC/none010.jpg
<br>
<br>http://i98.photobucket.com/albums/l259/Goreslinger/TC/none012.jpg

type-r wants its trademark back.

drumnatural
12-29-2007, 08:15 AM
type-r wants its trademark back.

:rotfl:

BernR6
12-30-2007, 12:53 PM
Yeah, this thread is old as hell, but I suppose I'll comment anyway. My wife has an 05 TC and I'm rockin' an 03 Type S. I like the TC...it's a nice car, but there's a few things I don't care for.

1. DBW throttle - can't shift smoothly at all...almost impossible to double clutch as well.
2. Doesn't handle quite as well as any of the Type S models - unless modified
3. Lower Redline - It's more fun to rev the crap out of the car IMO.

Things I do like about the TC

1. Toyota quality - Reliability and quality parts - just like Honda
2. More torque - On the "butt dyno" it feels pretty nice (it does have more tq from the factory anyway) - can definitely feel more pick up off the line than the type S. Although, at redline it falls on it's face, whereas the Type S is just getting started.
3. Nice looking car - doesn't feel quite as sporty, but does look aggressive, which I like.

There's my .02, cause I get the option of driving either on a daily basis. Although, I almost always drive my S. haha.