Disrespect to the flag. Saw this on another forum [Archive] - Club RSX Message Board

: Disrespect to the flag. Saw this on another forum


Fanatik
04-19-2008, 04:36 AM
I was on another forum and saw this. Anyone interested in letting the school president know what they think, here's his info:
Name: Theo Kalikow
Position: President
E-mail: kalikow@maine.edu
Telephone: 207-778-7256

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH9bVRAe4NE

I wrote a small and to the point email about how disappointed i was to see this.

many others did the same

i know 90% of crsx is anti military or full douchebag

so i posted it here

freedom of speech or not this is appalling

KillaICM
04-19-2008, 04:51 AM
Damn, that's crazy. If they don't like america they can get the fuck out. :rotfl:

!McLovin!
04-19-2008, 04:58 AM
Thats bullshit. Its even more depressing how they treat that Veteran. I don't know about you guys but when I am out and about and I see an older man or woman wearing their Clothing that says retired or what not I make it a point to shake their hand and let them know that the new generation of soldiers and marines appreciate what they have done.

Sir,

I recently came across the videotaping of a veteran demonstrating against the flag being painted on the floors. While I am not going to bother arguing whether its a disgrace or not, I do however find it very pathetic the way you and your staff treated that veteran. The man fought for your right to express your opinions and for your students to have freedom of artistic expression. But when it comes time for that man to express his opinion you won't have it? It doesn't work like that. He was not causing a scene or anything of the sort. I did not observe him being hostile towards you. He used tact and remained calm.

I am a college student myself serving in the national guard and participating in the ROTC program. I hope this incident isn't an indication of a deeper bias towards the military in a seemingly liberal education environment.

Please feel free to contact me via email. I look forward to a response.

SPC XXXXX
19th Special Forces.

arialdrone
04-19-2008, 02:18 PM
I was on another forum and saw this. Anyone interested in letting the school president know what they think, here's his info:
Name: Theo Kalikow
Position: President
E-mail: kalikow@maine.edu
Telephone: 207-778-7256

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH9bVRAe4NE

I wrote a small and to the point email about how disappointed i was to see this.

many others did the same

i know 90% of crsx is anti military or full douchebag

so i posted it here

freedom of speech or not this is appalling



x2 its not surprising these days. more or less just disappointing and or sickening:shakehead

email sent.

Reborn
04-19-2008, 03:19 PM
i couldnt hear shit in the video. what was the purpose behind painting flags on the floor?

Big Black Boss
04-20-2008, 12:32 AM
i know 90% of crsx is anti military or full douchebag


wtf?

!McLovin!
04-20-2008, 01:14 AM
wtf?

Its true.

mr2guysingh
04-20-2008, 12:35 PM
Thats fucked up, but seems like none of them stepped on the flags...

fcastle35
04-20-2008, 12:50 PM
Thats fucked up, but seems like none of them stepped on the flags...

expect the fuckin goth lookin kids u stood on it and had a conversation... they prob thought they were bein anarchists cause that is cool

mr2guysingh
04-20-2008, 01:57 PM
I didnt see that part. I have a lot of respect for the US flag

asininedervish
04-21-2008, 02:52 AM
I know a couple guys who go there, so maybe I know more about the situation than most.

It was an "art" project put on by a student, though more of a behavior observation. Put a bunch of duct-tape flags on the floor in a maze pattern, see who walks around, and who walks over.

Now, agree or disagree with it, it fulfilled a requirement she had for a class. Also, the administration has no legal grounds to stand on to prohibit it. It was not a fire hazard, or a danger to anyone. In all fairness, the veteran was wrong on this issue.

Nobody says you have to like it...but you cant stop it. And to encourage the viewpoint that it shouldnt be allowed is basically opposing the bill of rights.


P.S. The 'goth' kids were actually dressed up for a entirely separate and unrelated project.

F123456
04-21-2008, 03:02 AM
^^great first post. i think op and everyone sending in emails is overreacting about this video. if you guys are so offended by this type of stuff, why don't you go and help those homeless veterans get off the streets. i think that's more important than this

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 03:18 AM
why don't you go and help those homeless veterans get off the streets. i think that's more important than this

those homeless fuckers who claim to be veterans are full of shit, or they have mental issues.

i'm a veteran, and guess what.. i'm not even working right now ftw. all i do is go to school, work out, and eat.

!McLovin!
04-21-2008, 03:19 AM
those homeless fuckers who claim to be veterans are full of shit, or they have mental issues.

i'm a veteran, and guess what.. i'm not even working right now ftw. all i do is go to school, work out, and eat.

GI Bill ftw. Except I can't figure out how to apply:rotfl:

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 03:20 AM
yup. i get GI Bill plus school grants. fuk ya. i thank myself for being active duty before.

F123456
04-21-2008, 03:25 AM
those homeless fuckers who claim to be veterans are full of shit, or they have mental issues.

i'm a veteran, and guess what.. i'm not even working right now ftw. all i do is go to school, work out, and eat.

why would you assume that about them? i thought you guys supported the military :dontknow:

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 03:28 AM
why would you assume about them? i thought you guys supported the military :dontknow:

because veterans have tons of options once they get out. if you're a veteran and you're homeless, you're A. a lazy ass B. a mental case C. just plain dumb. fyi....a lot of those homeless dudes with vietnam vet ball caps are full of crap. they were never military...

and what do you mean with your second statement? when did we say we don't support the military? :dontknow: we're military too man. wtf

F123456
04-21-2008, 04:37 AM
if you fully support the military, why even question a guy holding a veteran sign asking for food/money? judging from your response, it doesn't seem like you give anything when you see these guys. you were in the service, so you should know better than i do, but homeless veterans are pretty common. this is what i mean with my 2nd statement.

i see lots of these threads raising a ruckus over some little thing where everyone supports it and then drive around seeing homeless veterans here and there where people just ignore. it just seems like you guys are taking offense to some really pointless issue such as the topic matter of this thread when you can make changes right in your own neighborhood. the person who did that little study did nothing wrong under the law, so why the ruckus? if it offends you that someone is able to do something like this and get away with it, then shouldn't you be emailing our law-makers or putting forth a proposal to adjust our constitutional rights so that people aren't allowed to do this? what is emailing the president of some school going to do?

Fanatik
04-21-2008, 08:16 AM
I know a couple guys who go there, so maybe I know more about the situation than most.

It was an "art" project put on by a student, though more of a behavior observation. Put a bunch of duct-tape flags on the floor in a maze pattern, see who walks around, and who walks over.

Now, agree or disagree with it, it fulfilled a requirement she had for a class. Also, the administration has no legal grounds to stand on to prohibit it. It was not a fire hazard, or a danger to anyone. In all fairness, the veteran was wrong on this issue.

Nobody says you have to like it...but you cant stop it. And to encourage the viewpoint that it shouldnt be allowed is basically opposing the bill of rights.


P.S. The 'goth' kids were actually dressed up for a entirely separate and unrelated project.

check neg for having dumbass class mates

my first ammendment right

Fanatik
04-21-2008, 08:17 AM
^^great first post. i think op and everyone sending in emails is overreacting about this video. if you guys are so offended by this type of stuff, why don't you go and help those homeless veterans get off the streets. i think that's more important than this

over-reacting

serious go back to ricerland and stay out of this section

i am offended. im offended that ive lost 2 friends and ancestors that died so you assholes can walk all over the very thing those guys died to protect

over reacting

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 08:27 AM
if you fully support the military, why even question a guy holding a veteran sign asking for food/money?

b/c believe it or not, there are a ton of ppl who join the military b/c they have an ultimatum...join the military or go to jail...then, when the little pussies get into the military, and find out, ZOMG I HAVE TO GO ON A DEPLOYMENT?!?!?!?!?!?!?

they do stupid shit like claim that they're crazy, or develop a drinking problem, or pop on a piss test, just to be separated so they don't have to go on deployment...hell, i went to "A" school w/ a guy, we got stationed on the same ship...were supposed to go on deployment 2 months after arriving onboard...he claims he's crazy, so they put him over in the mental ward for evaluation...he thought he was going to miss the whole deployment...he missed about 3 weeks of an 8 month deployment...ppl do stupid shit when they're scared...so, i'm not going to say all of the homeless vets are full of shit, but a lot of them are..and i'm willing to bet that most of them were dishonorably discharged

also, like ruel stated above...when you're separated, you're offered a lot of benefits, as long as you were separated honorably...

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 08:29 AM
I know a couple guys who go there, so maybe I know more about the situation than most.

It was an "art" project put on by a student, though more of a behavior observation. Put a bunch of duct-tape flags on the floor in a maze pattern, see who walks around, and who walks over.

Now, agree or disagree with it, it fulfilled a requirement she had for a class. Also, the administration has no legal grounds to stand on to prohibit it. It was not a fire hazard, or a danger to anyone. In all fairness, the veteran was wrong on this issue.

Nobody says you have to like it...but you cant stop it. And to encourage the viewpoint that it shouldnt be allowed is basically opposing the bill of rights.


P.S. The 'goth' kids were actually dressed up for a entirely separate and unrelated project.

^^great first post. i think op and everyone sending in emails is overreacting about this video. if you guys are so offended by this type of stuff, why don't you go and help those homeless veterans get off the streets. i think that's more important than this

are you guys military? ever been military? have family that has died or served in a war for the military?

i'm willing to bet, the answer is no

Phatzilla18
04-21-2008, 08:40 AM
That is a horrible disgrace.

OlieCan
04-21-2008, 09:33 AM
So, Im still not totally sure whats going on in this video, perhaps a link to a story would be in order...

What I gathered from posts is just some art project that a vet showed up at to protest cause flags are on the ground?

My opinion...

Its shitty that they seem to be treating the guy like shit, however, he needs to loosen up too. Honestly, its not that big of a deal. There are so many other things going on (even in regards to the flag ie: burning) that could be brought up.

The flag is a "symbol" of our freedom. It isn't freedom itself. Its not like if a flag gets stepped on, or burned, or shitted on, we lose our freedom. If freedom is supported so much, respect peoples freedom to protest, or to do what they want with the flag. This country is pretty much founded on people protesting left and right to make changes, so support it. If freedom is so important, let them be free.

Find something better to complain about. I support our troops (however not our fearless leader sending them there) and I wear the american flag on my uniform too, but there are bigger issues.

Sorry for being "anti-military / full douchebag"

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 09:36 AM
So, Im still not totally sure whats going on in this video, perhaps a link to a story would be in order...

What I gathered from posts is just some art project that a vet showed up at to protest cause flags are on the ground?

My opinion...

Its shitty that they seem to be treating the guy like shit, however, he needs to loosen up too. Honestly, its not that big of a deal. There are so many other things going on (even in regards to the flag ie: burning) that could be brought up.

The flag is a "symbol" of our freedom. It isn't freedom itself. Its not like if a flag gets stepped on, or burned, or shitted on, we lose our freedom. If freedom is supported so much, respect peoples freedom to protest, or to do what they want with the flag. This country is pretty much founded on people protesting left and right to make changes, so support it. If freedom is so important, let them be free.

Find something better to complain about. I support our troops (however not our fearless leader sending them there) and I wear the american flag on my uniform too, but there are bigger issues.

Sorry for being "anti-military / full douchebag"

yes, the flag is a symbol of our freedom, but ppl look at it as, "o it's just a flag"...do you guys realize how important the flag is? if the flag touches the ground, it is to be burned...

OlieCan
04-21-2008, 09:46 AM
yes, the flag is a symbol of our freedom, but ppl look at it as, "o it's just a flag"...do you guys realize how important the flag is? if the flag touches the ground, it is to be burned...

Yeah, I know people think "Its just a flag" and I do understand and support its meaning, but I think its a little too extreme...

We have a fucking huge huge flag at my fire department that we were trying to clean to hang outside for 9/11 and it was such a pain in the ass to try and clean it draped over like 500 chairs instead of just setting it on the ground. I don't feel its disrespectful to set a flag on the ground.

do you believe that had that flag touched the ground, it should be disposed of, and the department should have to buy a new flag that probably costs hundred and hundreds of dollars? Fuck that.

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 09:50 AM
Yeah, I know people think "Its just a flag" and I do understand and support its meaning, but I think its a little too extreme...

We have a fucking huge huge flag at my fire department that we were trying to clean to hang outside for 9/11 and it was such a pain in the ass to try and clean it draped over like 500 chairs instead of just setting it on the ground. I don't feel its disrespectful to set a flag on the ground.

do you believe that had that flag touched the ground, it should be disposed of, and the department should have to buy a new flag that probably costs hundred and hundreds of dollars? Fuck that.

of course i believe it...it's called customs and courtesies...it's taught in the military, so the respect that's given to the flag, is a lot greater than civilians respect for it (this video proves it)

OlieCan
04-21-2008, 09:54 AM
of course i believe it...it's called customs and courtesies...it's taught in the military, so the respect that's given to the flag, is a lot greater than civilians respect for it (this video proves it)

Well, I respect your opinion, and i assume you're maybe in, or have been in the military, so I respect you for that as well, however I respectfully disagree with some of your views on the flag, and I feel they are too extreme.

Would it be ok to throw a shirt with a flag on it on the floor, or in a pile of other clothes that are all soiled? Do any shirts or anything have to be washed seperately cause they might touch something dirty?



Edit: I gotta go detail my girls car cause she is trading it in for a new one after work, but I'd really like to continue this conversation later, and I hope this thread doesn't turn into a "fuck you faggot/hate fest" and get out of control. I think the thread started off bad by fanatik calling 90% of crsx douchebags, but hopefully it can stay with a real conversation with real opinions, and not just swearing.

I look forward to all responses.

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 10:00 AM
Well, I respect your opinion, and i assume you're maybe in, or have been in the military, so I respect you for that as well, however I respectfully disagree with some of your views on the flag, and I feel they are too extreme.

Would it be ok to throw a shirt with a flag on it on the floor, or in a pile of other clothes that are all soiled? Do any shirts or anything have to be washed seperately cause they might touch something dirty?

5 1/2 yrs. active duty navy (no longer in)

i respect your views and opinions as well, but like i said before, the respect for the flag and the true meaning of it, is taught throughout your enlistment (or at least it was for me)..

as far as flags on t-shirts, towels, etc...to me, those are just a company print...it's different to toss a shirt w/ a flag on it, on the ground, apposed to it being an actual flag

dc4todc5
04-21-2008, 10:18 AM
boohoo its a piece of cloth.

correction: a painting.

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 10:30 AM
boohoo its a piece of cloth.

correction: a painting.

thanks for adding to fanatik's statistic in post #1

F123456
04-21-2008, 10:39 AM
over-reacting

serious go back to ricerland and stay out of this section

i am offended. im offended that ive lost 2 friends and ancestors that died so you assholes can walk all over the very thing those guys died to protect

over reacting

i'm sorry for your loss, but this is the same statement i hear over and over again when i hear about some kind of disrespect made to the flag. yes i am grateful that there are people who are willing to risk their lives to protect our country, but as an example, do you really think that those 4,000+ guys died in iraq to protect america? i sure as hell don't feel any different/safer now that those guys died to "protect" my rights. i'm more offended that our government sent them over there in the first place and are now trying desperately to get them out. again, my point is that we have bigger things to worry about than topics like this. if you really want to talk about disrespect, go find the guy who thought up the idea to put the flag on a pair of boxers.

are you guys military? ever been military? have family that has died or served in a war for the military?

i'm willing to bet, the answer is no

i've never served in the military, but i have family and relatives who have. what do they tell me about it? that being out there in the field is just about the worst experience you can get yourself into. none of them want me to go through what they had to go through.

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 10:44 AM
if you really want to talk about disrespect, go find the guy who thought up the idea to put the flag on a pair of boxers.



i've never served in the military, but i have family and relatives who have. what do they tell me about it? that being out there in the field is just about the worst experience you can get yourself into. none of them want me to go through what they had to go through.

i agree w/ the first statement...i don't believe our flag should be put on clothing

as far as the 2nd statement...of course being over there is a horrible experience...no one said going to iraq was going to be tea parties and bullshit sessions...it's fucking war...but it's about pride, and wanting to serve your country...

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 12:55 PM
who cares?

is this any different than when people wear the flag? have them on their cars all ragged from blowing in the wind?

i didnt read past the first page so sorry if my points have been brought up already.

and hotrsx, thats a myth....you dont burn a flag that hits the ground. arent you in the military? you of all ppl should know that.

Airbomb
04-21-2008, 01:35 PM
If it were the gay pride flag or something to do with American Idol there would have been more outrage. It doesn't surpirse me at all at how out of touch people are when it comes to military matters or having some sense of pride in their nation. Unless your a fucking box of rocks, flags have always represented nations and stepping on the image of one has always been disrepectful.

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 01:43 PM
who cares?

is this any different than when people wear the flag? have them on their cars all ragged from blowing in the wind?

i didnt read past the first page so sorry if my points have been brought up already.

and hotrsx, thats a myth....you dont burn a flag that hits the ground. arent you in the military? you of all ppl should know that.

yes i was military, and no, that's not a myth...

i was a signalman in the navy, and not only were we taught that in "A" school, but it was also known on board ship

Zissou
04-21-2008, 01:45 PM
'...swat came into my school... disrespected my flag...'

sry had to ref that... and any asshole who thinks 'its just a flag' should spend a day in a 3rd world country where that flag doesnt fly, and learn a little respect, for this country, what it stands for, and what the military does for us.

Airbomb
04-21-2008, 01:48 PM
'...swat came into my school... disrespected my flag...'

sry had to ref that... and any asshole who thinks 'its just a flag' should spend a day in a 3rd world country where that flag doesnt fly, and learn a little respect, for this country, what it stands for, and what the military does for us.

When I was in Haiti and we were raiding these dirt shacks this dude had an American flag on his floor using it as a rug. When 3 US Marine infantymen saw that shit we just about shit bricks. The guy was delt with :)

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 01:50 PM
yes i was military, and no, that's not a myth...

i was a signalman in the navy, and not only were we taught that in "A" school, but it was also known on board ship

YES, it is a myth.

http://www.snopes.com/holidays/flagday/burnflag.asp

how many flags have you seen burnt?

i love my country, but some people read too deep into things.

this was an art project used to see if people would walk around the flag. they arent real flags but painted flags.

am i disrespecting the US?!

http://robertcolpitts.com/images/800px-Flag_of_the_United_States_(upside_down).gif

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 01:52 PM
YES, it is a myth.

http://www.snopes.com/holidays/flagday/burnflag.asp

how many flags have you seen burnt?

i love my country, but some people read too deep into things.

this was an art project used to see if people would walk around the flag. they arent real flags but painted flags.

am i disrespecting the US?!

http://robertcolpitts.com/images/800px-Flag_of_the_United_States_(upside_down).gif

:shakehead

i guess snopes in the next wiki on CRSX...i'm telling you what is taught to this day in "A" school, and aboard ship

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 01:54 PM
:shakehead

i guess snopes in the next wiki on CRSX...i'm telling you what is taught to this day in "A" school, and aboard ship
ok how about this

Standards of respect

* The flag should never be dipped to any person or thing, unless it is the ensign responding to a salute from a ship of a foreign nation. This tradition comes from the 1908 Summer Olympics in London, where countries were asked to dip their flag to King Edward VII: the American team flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused, famously proclaiming that "this flag dips to no earthly king."[1]
* The flag should never be displayed with the union (the starred blue canton) down, except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property. [2]
* The flag should not be used as "wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery",[1] or for covering a speaker's desk, draping a platform, or for any decoration in general (exception for coffins). Bunting of blue, white and red stripes is available for these purposes. The blue stripe of the bunting should be on the top.
* The flag should never be drawn back or bunched up in any way.
* The flag should never be used as a covering for a ceiling.
* The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed, or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use. Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard.
* The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, firefighters, police officers, and members of patriotic organizations. (Note that on Army uniforms, where the flag is put on the sleeve of the uniform, the flag patch is displayed with the stars facing forward, in the direction the wearer is facing. This is done to give the impression of the flag flowing in the wind while being carried forward across the battlefield. This is known as the "Reverse Field Flag.") Flag lapel pins may also be worn.
* The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.
* The flag should never be used as a receptacle for receiving, holding, carrying, or delivering anything.

* The flag should not be draped over the hood, top, sides, or back of a vehicle, railroad train, or boat.
* When the flag is lowered, no part of it should touch the ground or any other object; it should be received by waiting hands and arms. To store the flag it should be folded neatly and ceremoniously.
* The flag should be cleaned and mended when necessary.
* If the flag is being used at a public or private estate, it should not be hung (unless at half mast) during rain or violent weather.
* When a flag is so tattered that can no longer serve as a symbol of the United States, it should be destroyed in a dignified manner, preferably by burning. The American Legion and other organizations regularly conduct dignified flag-burning ceremonies, often on Flag Day, June 14.
* The flag should never touch anything beneath it. Contrary to an urban legend, the flag code does not state that a flag that touches the ground should be burned. Instead, the flag should be moved so it is not touching the ground.[3]

just because you can easily find information on the internet (snoops in this case) doesnt make that information false.

you are wrong.

since when could anyone go in and edit snoops? never, yep never.

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 01:59 PM
ok how about this

Standards of respect

* The flag should never be dipped to any person or thing, unless it is the ensign responding to a salute from a ship of a foreign nation. This tradition comes from the 1908 Summer Olympics in London, where countries were asked to dip their flag to King Edward VII: the American team flag bearer, Ralph Rose, refused, famously proclaiming that "this flag dips to no earthly king."[1]
* The flag should never be displayed with the union (the starred blue canton) down, except as a signal of dire distress in instances of extreme danger to life or property. [2]
* The flag should not be used as "wearing apparel, bedding, or drapery",[1] or for covering a speaker's desk, draping a platform, or for any decoration in general (exception for coffins). Bunting of blue, white and red stripes is available for these purposes. The blue stripe of the bunting should be on the top.
* The flag should never be drawn back or bunched up in any way.
* The flag should never be used as a covering for a ceiling.
* The flag should never be used for any advertising purpose. It should not be embroidered, printed, or otherwise impressed on such articles as cushions, handkerchiefs, napkins, boxes, or anything intended to be discarded after temporary use. Advertising signs should not be attached to the staff or halyard.
* The flag should not be used as part of a costume or athletic uniform, except that a flag patch may be used on the uniform of military personnel, firefighters, police officers, and members of patriotic organizations. (Note that on Army uniforms, where the flag is put on the sleeve of the uniform, the flag patch is displayed with the stars facing forward, in the direction the wearer is facing. This is done to give the impression of the flag flowing in the wind while being carried forward across the battlefield. This is known as the "Reverse Field Flag.") Flag lapel pins may also be worn.
* The flag should never have placed on it, or attached to it, any mark, insignia, letter, word, number, figure, or drawing of any kind.
* The flag should never be used as a receptacle for receiving, holding, carrying, or delivering anything.

* The flag should not be draped over the hood, top, sides, or back of a vehicle, railroad train, or boat.
* When the flag is lowered, no part of it should touch the ground or any other object; it should be received by waiting hands and arms. To store the flag it should be folded neatly and ceremoniously.
* The flag should be cleaned and mended when necessary.
* If the flag is being used at a public or private estate, it should not be hung (unless at half mast) during rain or violent weather.
* When a flag is so tattered that can no longer serve as a symbol of the United States, it should be destroyed in a dignified manner, preferably by burning. The American Legion and other organizations regularly conduct dignified flag-burning ceremonies, often on Flag Day, June 14.
* The flag should never touch anything beneath it. Contrary to an urban legend, the flag code does not state that a flag that touches the ground should be burned. Instead, the flag should be moved so it is not touching the ground.[3]

just because you can easily find information on the internet (snoops in this case) doesnt make that information false.

you are wrong.

since when could anyone go in and edit snoops? never, yep never.

well then i guess the United States Navy is wrong :rolleyes:

this was taught in signalman "A" school in 2002

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 02:02 PM
well then i guess the United States Navy is wrong :rolleyes:

this was taught in signalman "A" school in 2002
well i didnt say it but i havent found one source to prove you correct.

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 02:03 PM
well i didnt say it but i havent found one source to prove you correct.

well then i guess the United States Navy is wrong :rolleyes:

this was taught in signalman "A" school in 2002

:coffee:

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 02:05 PM
:coffee:
anyone can type anything.

ive found nurmous of sources that say im correct and you are incorrect.

http://www.usflag.org/uscode36.html
http://www.ushistory.org/BETSY/flagetiq.html
http://www.access.gpo.gov/uscode/title4/chapter1_.html
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=browse_usc&docid=Cite:+4USC8


i can go on forever...

!McLovin!
04-21-2008, 02:08 PM
anyone can type anything.

ive found nurmous of sources that say im correct and you are incorrect.

http://www.usflag.org/uscode36.html
http://www.ushistory.org/BETSY/flagetiq.html
http://www.access.gpo.gov/uscode/title4/chapter1_.html
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=browse_usc&docid=Cite:+4USC8


i can go on forever...

**edited insult**. Go get a haircut.

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 02:08 PM
anyone can type anything.

ive found nurmous of sources that say im correct and you are incorrect.

http://www.usflag.org/uscode36.html
http://www.ushistory.org/BETSY/flagetiq.html
http://www.access.gpo.gov/uscode/title4/chapter1_.html
http://frwebgate.access.gpo.gov/cgi-bin/getdoc.cgi?dbname=browse_usc&docid=Cite:+4USC8


i can go on forever...

meh, either way, the flag should not touch the ground

Dripto
04-21-2008, 02:09 PM
LMAO!! getting worked up over some paintings or whatever on the floor that resembles the US flag. yet i respect your patriotism.

however, there are waayyy more important things you can do for your country than to rant on about something like that.


i know 90% of crsx is anti military or full douchebag


i'm guessing you fall into the latter considering that was absolutely uncalled for.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 02:10 PM
meh, either way, the flag should not touch the ground

lol.

but its also not a flag on the youtube video.

its a painting of a flag.

can i bring a gun into school? no

can i bring a painting of a gun to school? yes

see the difference?

no harm done

!McLovin!
04-21-2008, 02:11 PM
LMAO!! getting worked up over some paintings or whatever on the floor that resembles the US flag. yet i respect your patriotism.

however, there are waayyy more important things you can do for your country than to rant on about something like that.



i'm guessing you fall into the latter considering that was absolutely uncalled for.

Why not? the thread where over 50% of CRSX thinks 9/11 was a government conspiracy is enough for me...

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 02:14 PM
Why not? the thread where over 50% of CRSX thinks 9/11 was a government conspiracy is enough for me...
who cares? its not like we'll ever know.

all you have is faith, faith is what you believe. who cares why you think what, but if you have a good reason for thinking what you think then think it. better to ask questions then sit idle while having orders shoved in your face. you have a brain for a reason.

!McLovin!
04-21-2008, 02:16 PM
who cares? its not like we'll ever know.

all you have is faith, faith is what you believe. who cares why you think what, but if you have a good reason for thinking what you think then think it. better to ask questions then sit idle while having orders shoved in your face. you have a brain for a reason.

We already know who did it dumb ass. Suprise, it wasn't George Bush.

The liberals bash bush and say hes so stupid. Do you really think hes smart enough to complete that kind of cover up? Give me a break.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 02:19 PM
thread >>>>>>

thread direction <<<<<<<<<<<<<<

!McLovin!
04-21-2008, 02:20 PM
thread >>>>>>

thread direction <<<<<<<<<<<<<<

What you meant to say was "Im wrong but lets not go down this path of proof any further"

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 02:21 PM
What you meant to say was "Im wrong but lets not go down this path of proof any further"
wrong about what? not knowing about 9/11?


does 9/11 have anything to do with disrespecting the flag?

Dripto
04-21-2008, 02:21 PM
We already know who did it dumb ass. Suprise, it wasn't George Bush.

The liberals bash bush and say hes so stupid. Do you really think hes smart enough to complete that kind of cover up? Give me a break.

true he is stupid. but think about it, if he were THAT stupid how did he become the US president? how is it that he is one of the wealthiest americans in the country?

you will meet people in life who appear to be extremely stupid and do stupid things but when the time comes to screw other people over and make money they are tops!

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 02:29 PM
i think that people should stop bitching about this. think about what exactly you are crying about....


an art student painted flags
placed them on the ground
????????
crying

THEY ARENT EVEN REAL FLAGS lmao

get a grip people.

they are disrespecting the medium that the flag was painted on, not a flag.

i draw a flag on a piece of paper and throw it away, disrespect? no

a flag is rendered into a video game and it some how falls to the ground, disrespect? no

it isnt a flag, its a painting of a flag.

!McLovin!
04-21-2008, 02:31 PM
Just got this response.

Dear Mr. XXXXXXX: Thanks very much for your message. While I personally
found the art project disgusting, since I would never disrespect the
flag, our American First Amendment protections include the right to
free speech and artistic expression, even speech that is repugnant
and unpleasant and offensive. UMF, as a teaching and learning
institution, has an obligation to foster debate and disagreement
about difficult subjects -- this is an essential part of our
democracy. Thanks for your expression of your point of view. And
since you yourself are a service member, then my deepest thanks for
your service and sacrifice. Sincerely, Theodora J. Kalikow,
President. P.S. UMF welcomed a demonstration last Thursday of about
100 veterans in support of the flag. It was respectfully received by
faculty, students and staff.

asininedervish
04-21-2008, 03:23 PM
over-reacting

serious go back to ricerland and stay out of this section

i am offended. im offended that ive lost 2 friends and ancestors that died so you assholes can walk all over the very thing those guys died to protect

over reacting

Just to put this out there, I'm currently active-duty USAF. And out of the same group of friends, 2 went into the army, 1 marines. Another 4 went to college. I've decided long ago that I dont fight for whatever the president says I should. Or what is required as "proof" that I love my country.

I fight for the ideals which made America great. The freedom to live our lives to the fullest, to the best of our ability. The right to disagree with the government, and each other.

These are the things I care about. These are the things that I signed for. And I'm sorry, the flag is not one of them. Its a symbol, and that gives it meaning. Not everyone has the same opinion on what it stands for. Sorry if that bothers you.

Still would prefer that they're able to do it. You can state your opinion all you want! and nobody made you walk on the flag, or place one on the ground. But you cannot control other people!!!!!

/Rant.

dc4todc5
04-21-2008, 03:30 PM
Honestly, im no history guru but as far as im concerned the only soldiers who i have respect for are those who fought in the the early neccesary wars (revolutionary, civil etc)the two world wars and i guess vietnam and i say i guess with vietnam b/c it was an unneccesary war but i belive they implemented a draft if not i stand corrected. But to these dudes who try to act all high and mighty because they joined the navy a year ago choke on a testicle. If i was in the militairy and they tried to send me to Iraq i would refuse, thats right REFUSE, and they could put me in jail for all i fucking care. Id rather work for McDonalds then accept a little bonus check and become Uncle Sams bitch. Lets get one thing straight, I dont give a fuck about our country, i care about the people in it. You want to get all emotional over the logo of a corrupt ass government go right ahead, you look like a fucking idiot as far as im concerned.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 03:33 PM
http://www.forumspile.com/Thread-I_like_where_this_thread_is_going.jpg

Fanatik
04-21-2008, 04:13 PM
of course i believe it...it's called customs and courtesies...it's taught in the military, so the respect that's given to the flag, is a lot greater than civilians respect for it (this video proves it)

Well, I respect your opinion, and i assume you're maybe in, or have been in the military, so I respect you for that as well, however I respectfully disagree with some of your views on the flag, and I feel they are too extreme.

Would it be ok to throw a shirt with a flag on it on the floor, or in a pile of other clothes that are all soiled? Do any shirts or anything have to be washed seperately cause they might touch something dirty?



Edit: I gotta go detail my girls car cause she is trading it in for a new one after work, but I'd really like to continue this conversation later, and I hope this thread doesn't turn into a "fuck you faggot/hate fest" and get out of control. I think the thread started off bad by fanatik calling 90% of crsx douchebags, but hopefully it can stay with a real conversation with real opinions, and not just swearing.

I look forward to all responses.

seriously just stop

from the moment you raise your right hand its engraved in your very being the american flag does not touch the ground

as a firefighter i would assume they teach you this as well

i guess not

Fanatik
04-21-2008, 04:15 PM
i'm sorry for your loss, but this is the same statement i hear over and over again when i hear about some kind of disrespect made to the flag. yes i am grateful that there are people who are willing to risk their lives to protect our country, but as an example, do you really think that those 4,000+ guys died in iraq to protect america? i sure as hell don't feel any different/safer now that those guys died to "protect" my rights. i'm more offended that our government sent them over there in the first place and are now trying desperately to get them out. again, my point is that we have bigger things to worry about than topics like this. if you really want to talk about disrespect, go find the guy who thought up the idea to put the flag on a pair of boxers.



i've never served in the military, but i have family and relatives who have. what do they tell me about it? that being out there in the field is just about the worst experience you can get yourself into. none of them want me to go through what they had to go through.

hmmm ever heard of ww1 and ww2 Korean war. see sadly enough todays youth only see the iraq war and call bullshit no matter what


they forget the millions that died to get us to where we are today which is my point of this thread

Fanatik
04-21-2008, 04:17 PM
LMAO!! getting worked up over some paintings or whatever on the floor that resembles the US flag. yet i respect your patriotism.

however, there are waayyy more important things you can do for your country than to rant on about something like that.



i'm guessing you fall into the latter considering that was absolutely uncalled for.

boohoo its a piece of cloth.

correction: a painting.



here comes the back up of my claim

thanks guys i knew i could count on u

HotRSX21
04-21-2008, 04:23 PM
Honestly, im no history guru but as far as im concerned the only soldiers who i have respect for are those who fought in the the early neccesary wars (revolutionary, civil etc)the two world wars and i guess vietnam and i say i guess with vietnam b/c it was an unneccesary war but i belive they implemented a draft if not i stand corrected. But to these dudes who try to act all high and mighty because they joined the navy a year ago choke on a testicle. If i was in the militairy and they tried to send me to Iraq i would refuse, thats right REFUSE, and they could put me in jail for all i fucking care. Id rather work for McDonalds then accept a little bonus check and become Uncle Sams bitch. Lets get one thing straight, I dont give a fuck about our country, i care about the people in it. You want to get all emotional over the logo of a corrupt ass government go right ahead, you look like a fucking idiot as far as im concerned.

o damn, didn't realize what i said made me look all high and mighty :coffee:

you sir, sound like a "fucking idiot"...nowhere in any of my posts did i say i was "high and mighty" or better than anyone else...i served 5 1/2 yrs. in the navy and did 2 deployments...i'm proud of what i did...if you're not, so be it, i really could give 2 shits what you think about it

Fanatik
04-21-2008, 04:26 PM
i love to laff

when civilians come in and try to argue military customs and courtesy's and tell us we are wrong

:D

MinGrey02Stg2
04-21-2008, 04:30 PM
Despicable. I'd love to beat those hippies half to death in front of everyone who were standing on the flag. Good job to that veteran and a big fuck you to those who opposed him. It's sad that today there is no outrage by those walking through... it would have been nice to see an overwhelming opinion against it instead of a tolerance.

OlieCan
04-21-2008, 04:44 PM
seriously just stop

from the moment you raise your right hand its engraved in your very being the american flag does not touch the ground

as a firefighter i would assume they teach you this as well

i guess not

Believe it or not, firefighting has very little to do with flag etiquette... :rolleyes:

That being said, I raised my right hand to swear that I would protect the people of my district, and any member in need.

Clearly you're the immature one ont his subject calling anyone with an opinion stupid just because it doesn't fit with yours.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 04:45 PM
But to these dudes who try to act all high and mighty because they joined the navy a year ago choke on a testicle.

you have the right to your opinion, but what's your problem, man? who/what pissed you off for you to say this?

Id rather work for McDonalds then accept a little bonus check and become Uncle Sams bitch.

i work hell of a lot less in my job than most jobs you'll find out there, including mcdonald's.

here's my typical daily schedule: wake up; eat, prepare a brief; brief the Captain; eat; watch tv; work out; eat; sleep; repeat.

wow.....difficult huh.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 05:00 PM
however, there are waayyy more important things you can do for your country than to rant on about something like that.


the people ranting against flag desecration protect the very soil you are standing on.

STLuNaTiC_v34
04-21-2008, 05:03 PM
Sorry guys. Have to disagree with you here.
Army wear "flags" on their ACUs. They roll around in the dirt and mud all day. They get dirty, but do they burn their patches? No.
If they drop their velcro flag patches, do they have to burn each of them, every single time? No.
Before ACUs, they had to sew their patches on, which meant poking holes through the patch in its entirety. Disrespect? Nope.
Once again, it's an image of a flag, and not an actual "flag."

I think my opinion would be different if the intent was different. (i.e. people stomping on it to make a "statement.")

!McLovin!
04-21-2008, 05:24 PM
Sorry guys. Have to disagree with you here.
Army wear "flags" on their ACUs. They roll around in the dirt and mud all day. They get dirty, but do they burn their patches? No.
If they drop their velcro flag patches, do they have to burn each of them, every single time? No.
Before ACUs, they had to sew their patches on, which meant poking holes through the patch in its entirety. Disrespect? Nope.
Once again, it's an image of a flag, and not an actual "flag."

I think my opinion would be different if the intent was different. (i.e. people stomping on it to make a "statement.")

We replace our flags when they're deemed no longer serviceable. I clean mine with a brush and toothpaste. Try it, it works wonders.

Bottom line you lazy, cowardly civilian fat bodies. You're wrong. You aren't educated on the history of the flag nor the customs and courtesies of the military. We can't blame you for being wrong but don't try and tell us our job.

I wouldn't walk into McDonalds and tell half of the crsx users how to make my McFlurry.

Heres a piece of trivia for you. At the top of every flag pole on every US Military installation there is a book of matches and one bullet.

STLuNaTiC_v34
04-21-2008, 05:36 PM
Heres a piece of trivia for you. At the top of every flag pole on every US Military installation there is a book of matches and one bullet.

:shakehead

actually I'd rather believe these better:

http://www.all-lies.com/legends/government/military/flagpoles.shtml

As romantic as the notion might be that a military flagpole contains everything a soon-to-be-defeated soldier needs, it is totally false. There is nothing in the gold ball on top of a military flagpole, and if it could be unscrewed someone would have stolen it by now.

Military flagpoles do, however, have a small cache of supplies buried at their base. These include easy-to-erect barriers, several fully automatic rifles and handguns, thousands of rounds of ammunition, grenades, and a few anti-tank rockets. The idea is that the last few survivors of a raid might be able to hold off attackers Alamo-style until help arrives. Certainly this makes more sense than a grain of rice and a penny.

In addition, U.S. flagpoles are filled with explosives that can be triggered by a hidden switch at the pole's base. These explosives will destroy the flag to prevent its capture and kill or seriously wound anyone within 100 meters, hopefully taking out a big batch of attackers in a final blaze of glory. These explosives exist in all U.S. government-owned flagpoles, including those in public schools.

!McLovin!
04-21-2008, 05:44 PM
:shakehead

actually I'd rather believe these better:

http://www.all-lies.com/legends/government/military/flagpoles.shtml

As romantic as the notion might be that a military flagpole contains everything a soon-to-be-defeated soldier needs, it is totally false. There is nothing in the gold ball on top of a military flagpole, and if it could be unscrewed someone would have stolen it by now.

Military flagpoles do, however, have a small cache of supplies buried at their base. These include easy-to-erect barriers, several fully automatic rifles and handguns, thousands of rounds of ammunition, grenades, and a few anti-tank rockets. The idea is that the last few survivors of a raid might be able to hold off attackers Alamo-style until help arrives. Certainly this makes more sense than a grain of rice and a penny.

In addition, U.S. flagpoles are filled with explosives that can be triggered by a hidden switch at the pole's base. These explosives will destroy the flag to prevent its capture and kill or seriously wound anyone within 100 meters, hopefully taking out a big batch of attackers in a final blaze of glory. These explosives exist in all U.S. government-owned flagpoles, including those in public schools.

These are the same websites that bring to you George Bush=Hitler=9/11

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 06:19 PM
These are the same websites that bring to you George Bush=Hitler=9/11
lol good answer

"hey im m52slow and i have no real rebuttal so i'm going to throw some more 9/11 garbage at you to throw you off track. i have no real proof as to what i am saying but will back my claims with an ignorant answer that shows i know all (very little) about the military but really dont know my head from my ass."

its so anti military because it has FACTS about your NONFACTS. maybe you should become an hero and put that "bullet" at the top of the pole to use there.

so what MYTHS have been BUSTED here

-you dont burn a flag that touches a ground
-there is nothing inside the ball of the flag poll
-m52slow provides very little argument so uses some 9/11 bs crying about hippies.

F123456
04-21-2008, 09:02 PM
hmmm ever heard of ww1 and ww2 Korean war. see sadly enough todays youth only see the iraq war and call bullshit no matter what


they forget the millions that died to get us to where we are today which is my point of this thread

of course i've heard of those wars, but the CURRENT war is what's important. sadly, today's older serviceman are stuck in the past and believe that fighting every war is about protecting the rights of Americans. again, if that were the case, why even make a thread on this pointless issue? she had the right of free speech and you complain that it is appalling. from reading the response of the university official, it seems like of all the emailing was a waste of time.

if you want to talk about disrespect, look at this:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080421/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/military_felons

The scum of america are increasing in numbers within the military. I'm supposed to honor these guys if they die in battle? Hell no.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 09:08 PM
The scum of america are increasing in numbers within the military. I'm supposed to honor these guys if they die in battle? Hell no.

do you know about the vietnam war era?

convicted felons had two choices back then: go to prison or join the marines or army. my dad told me about that.

you think that little tiny increase of felons is bad these days? well thousands of them fought the war in vietnam.

and fyi, what you're reading in that article is only recent stuff. when i came in in 1996, you had to have the cleanest record to join any branch of the military.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 09:11 PM
of course i've heard of those wars, but the CURRENT war is what's important. sadly, today's older serviceman are stuck in the past and believe that fighting every war is about protecting the rights of Americans. again, if that were the case, why even make a thread on this pointless issue? she had the right of free speech and you complain that it is appalling. from reading the response of the university official, it seems like of all the emailing was a waste of time.

if you want to talk about disrespect, look at this:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080421/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/military_felons

The scum of america are increasing in numbers within the military. I'm supposed to honor these guys if they die in battle? Hell no.
word.

oh hey lets cry about painted flags on the ground while the ARMY and MARINES DROP their standards in order to have more men and woman fight this pissing contest of a war.

we are protecting the rights of people yet at the sametime crying about some art project.

its hard to honor pedophiles and murders, even if they wear my countries flag.

i have had family serve in WW2 and close friends in the current war so it hits home for me. i respect the military and its service members, just not the extremest members.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 09:11 PM
do you know about the vietnam war era?

convicted felons had two choices back then: go to prison or join the marines or army. my dad told me about that.

you think that little tiny increase of felons is bad these days? well thousands of them fought the war in vietnam.

and fyi, what you're reading in that article is only recent stuff. when i came in in 1996, you had to have the cleanest record to join any branch of the military.
history repeats its self its self

GhostStriker
04-21-2008, 09:14 PM
First off, the US flag doesnt just represent the US. It is a symbol of freedom and democracy around the world. People fight for and die for that freedom, not just so that people in the US can take advantage of it and maintain it, but so that its benefits can be spread to everyone, as a basic human right. In todays world this specifically applies to the Iraqis. So go burn, spit on, walk on, do whatever to the flag. You can never kill what it really stands for, only insult the memory of those more honorable that died to protect those ideals.

As a former member of an Army color guard and funeral honors team, I have had a lot of hands on time rendering respect to the flag. But Ill be the first to tell everyone that while tradition and respect call for many things, practicality often demands otherwise.

For example, I was observing a veterans funeral on a cold winter day in NC, so cold that funeral team had to wear the leather dress gloves. During the part where you fold the flag into a triangle, one of the guys was pulling it so taught it slipped out of the hands of the other and briefly touched the ground. Did we stop the funeral, strip the flag of its stars and bars before burning it? No. They picked it up, finished folding it, and presented it to the family. Afterwords the family was asked if they wanted another flag, but they said no, they wanted the one that had draped their veterans coffin.

Bottom line, there are a lot of traditions taught in the military, burning it into retirement, the symbolic elements of the flag pole, etc. I have heard from some extremely reliable sources that the only pole on a post that actually follows tradition is the main post flag pole. Whether thats actually true or not, I will probably never know, but its tradition and symbolism none the less.

Lastly, to you civilians who insist on commenting on "homeless veterans".. would you comment on quantum mechanics or some other theory or principal with which you would not even begin to know where to start? Please believe me when i say that the complex system of veterans benefits is the same kind of thing, it takes someone experienced to make a comment which actually provides truthful and useful information.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 09:24 PM
**edited**
Sure, believe the internet over customs taught to thousands of military personnel.

you **edited** dont see that i sourced my info from LEGIT DOT GOV WEBSITES **edited**

F123456
04-21-2008, 09:29 PM
do you know about the vietnam war era?

convicted felons had two choices back then: go to prison or join the marines or army. my dad told me about that.

you think that little tiny increase of felons is bad these days? well thousands of them fought the war in vietnam.

and fyi, what you're reading in that article is only recent stuff. when i came in in 1996, you had to have the cleanest record to join any branch of the military.

i know about the vietnam war. my dad was a prisoner for a year. i think it's a good thing that they're letting convicts enlist: you kill two birds with one stone so to speak. i'm just against the fact that i'm supposed to honor every serviceman because they have "protected" me and my country when a good amount of these guys are in the military because they abused their american rights.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 09:32 PM
why honer someone just because their willing to die for your country? sure they may die for america but they rape, steal, and beat your neighbor. not someone i'm proud to say served my country.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 09:34 PM
i'm just against the fact that i'm supposed to honor every serviceman because they have "protected" me and my country when a good amount of these guys are in the military because they abused their american rights.

ya but they are grunts.

military personnel who don't have intelligence can wind up on the battle field or cleaning bathrooms.

F123456
04-21-2008, 09:34 PM
First off, the US flag doesnt just represent the US. It is a symbol of freedom and democracy around the world. People fight for and die for that freedom, not just so that people in the US can take advantage of it and maintain it, but so that its benefits can be spread to everyone, as a basic human right. In todays world this specifically applies to the Iraqis. So go burn, spit on, walk on, do whatever to the flag. You can never kill what it really stands for, only insult the memory of those more honorable that died to protect those ideals.

As a former member of an Army color guard and funeral honors team, I have had a lot of hands on time rendering respect to the flag. But Ill be the first to tell everyone that while tradition and respect call for many things, practicality often demands otherwise.

For example, I was observing a veterans funeral on a cold winter day in NC, so cold that funeral team had to wear the leather dress gloves. During the part where you fold the flag into a triangle, one of the guys was pulling it so taught it slipped out of the hands of the other and briefly touched the ground. Did we stop the funeral, strip the flag of its stars and bars before burning it? No. They picked it up, finished folding it, and presented it to the family. Afterwords the family was asked if they wanted another flag, but they said no, they wanted the one that had draped their veterans coffin.

Bottom line, there are a lot of traditions taught in the military, burning it into retirement, the symbolic elements of the flag pole, etc. I have heard from some extremely reliable sources that the only pole on a post that actually follows tradition is the main post flag pole. Whether thats actually true or not, I will probably never know, but its tradition and symbolism none the less.

Lastly, to you civilians who insist on commenting on "homeless veterans".. would you comment on quantum mechanics or some other theory or principal with which you would not even begin to know where to start? Please believe me when i say that the complex system of veterans benefits is the same kind of thing, it takes someone experienced to make a comment which actually provides truthful and useful information.

I used this as an example because i see it every day and people could care less. Are you trying to tell me that homeless veterans do not exist because there are benefits out there for them when they come home?

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 09:40 PM
sure they may die for america but they rape, steal, and beat your neighbor.

..ya and so do doctors and policemen. :rolleyes:

what u just said was a poor example.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 09:42 PM
..ya and so do doctors and policemen. :rolleyes:

what u just said was a poor example.
but do i have to honor them?

i'm unamerican if i dont right?

are they shown on the news as heroes?

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 09:42 PM
Are you trying to tell me that homeless veterans do not exist because there are benefits out there for them when they come home?

homeless people come from all walks of life. i'm sure there are homeless veterans out there. but the ones who are like that have mental issues.

dude......i know countless numbers of veterans. uh they are not homeless.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 09:44 PM
but do i have to honor them?

i'm unamerican if i dont right?

nope of course not.

are they shown on the news as heroes?

i'm sure some of them are.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 09:45 PM
fyi fuzzie.....i'm a veteran. i'm not homeless lol.

yes, i'm currently a naval reservist, but i still qualify as a veteran, since i used to be active duty.

Airbomb
04-21-2008, 09:48 PM
:rotfl:

This thread is awesome

Not only am I a rapist, theif, and I beat my neighbor but I'm also stupid, have no intelligence, and am homeless!

GhostStriker
04-21-2008, 09:49 PM
I used this as an example because i see it every day and people could care less. Are you trying to tell me that homeless veterans do not exist because there are benefits out there for them when they come home?

Would you like to show me where I said homeless veterans dont exist? Oh yeah, I didnt. So please dont inject misinformation into my posts, thank you.

Im from the Los Angeles/Orange County area, in fact I work about 10 minutes from down town. I see "homeless" people all the time, and quite a few with their signs reading something like "homless vet, please help". And they are they last people I would give money to. I dont really care if they lie to me, but when they claim to be veterans and saw action here or were on SEAL team 6 at this time doing behind the lines operations in Cambodia in the 80s... To me thats the same as a soldier wearing a purple heart or valor award that he didnt earn. Dishonorable beyond all shame. They do not deserve my sympathy, pity or much less money.

When Im on foot I love to engage them in seemingly casual conversation to see how much bullshit I can possibly elicit in as little time as possible, and nearly every time it still amazes me. Actually, my building's gym is used as a homeless shelter on winter nights, so homeless people are always coming up at other times wanting to beg off of us. So basically, the number of "homless veterans" I have spoken with is well into the 100's. Id say maybe 5 to 10 of them gave me a remotely believable story. I had one dude get pissed and start yelling at me because I wouldnt call him general, salute him, and let him into the building without a military ID.

For those that are actual homeless veterans, 99% of them have more to the story that they dont want to tell you, because the government/VA would most likely otherwise help them.

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 09:50 PM
:rotfl:

This thread is awesome

Not only am I a rapist, theif, and I beat my neighbor but I'm also stupid, have no intelligence, and am homeless!
nobody said you, but the people that the military lets in who are convicted felons.

incase you missed it

Under pressure to meet combat needs, the Army and Marine Corps brought in significantly more recruits with felony convictions last year than in 2006, including some with manslaughter and sex crime convictions

to meet combat needs, we will drop or standards and take people who are fucked in the head and toss them into war.

i'm sure they'll come back A O K! :thumbsup:

GhostStriker
04-21-2008, 09:52 PM
You know, im more likely to give money to the homeless people that have the signs like "Ninjas killed my family, need money for karate lessons" or "need money for alcohol research". At Least they have the balls to be honest with me.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 09:56 PM
speaking of homeless, here's a news clip from my last ship when i was active duty:



Vinson Sailors Help Restore Shelter Store

Story by MC2 Maja Dyson

NEWPORT NEWS Va. – Four USS Carl Vinson (CVN 70) Sailors helped restore hope for homeless children and families during a community relations (COMREL) project April 8, at the For Kids, Inc., shelter in Norfolk, Va.

http://www.cvn70.navy.mil/


:rotfl:

arialdrone
04-21-2008, 09:58 PM
half of the stuff i just read in this thread literally disgusted me... a serious **edited** to anyone who doesn't appreciate what the military does for you.

F123456
04-21-2008, 10:01 PM
You know, im more likely to give money to the homeless people that have the signs like "Ninjas killed my family, need money for karate lessons" or "need money for alcohol research". At Least they have the balls to be honest with me.

like i mentioned earlier, if you fully supported the military and its veterans, why even question a guy holding a veteran sign asking for some food/change? i mean, you get offended by the story the op posted even though there was nothing wrong with what the person did, but you question/mock someone who you could help immediately. do you always interrogate every homeless "veteran" before you help them out?

GhostStriker
04-21-2008, 10:08 PM
like i mentioned earlier, if you fully supported the military and its veterans, why even question a guy holding a veteran sign asking for some food/change? i mean, you get offended by the story the op posted even though there was nothing wrong with what the person did, but you question/mock someone who you could help immediately. do you always interrogate every homeless "veteran" before you help them out?

Once again, injecting information into my posts which I never said.

I never said anything about what the student not being allowed to protest as he did. I was speaking in generalities when it came to the symbolism of the flag.

And no, I dont interrogate every homeless "veteran" before I help them out. I just interrogate them, and then dont help them.

Airbomb
04-21-2008, 10:14 PM
nobody said you, but the people that the military lets in who are convicted felons.

incase you missed it



to meet combat needs, we will drop or standards and take people who are fucked in the head and toss them into war.

i'm sure they'll come back A O K! :thumbsup:

I former Marine grunt so that would apply to me based on what has been said in this thread. Generalizing stereotypes posted by people who have no fucking idea including some over motivated military members.

It's a shame that they do have to lower the standards and then have people bitch about it because their too much of a vagina to step up and do the jobs themselves. You must live in an outstanding country where you can get the lower end of society to put their ass on the line so you don't have to do a damned thing but bitch about it. Then declare those people as undesirable meaning you don't have to respect them for being active enough to do shit everyone else won't because they are too busy posting Youtube videos and watching American Idol.
I mean look at the atrocity when it comes to VA healthcare.

The majority of citizens could careless because they aren’t the ones getting so called “benefits” because they are just too fucking self centered to understand that maybe they do owe those that stepped up to fill the spot many don’t want be in. So you have these citizens who look down on those who serve in the military as idiots and criminals while reaping all the perks.

Dripto
04-21-2008, 10:17 PM
the people ranting against flag desecration protect the very soil you are standing on.

first of all i am NOT standing on your soil so keep that in mind next time you decide to pile that nonsense on me.

if you open your eyes to actually perceive WTF is really going on you will see that the people you talk of are not going there to protect US soil. in fact they THINK they are going there for the following reasons:

1) doing something patriotic by joining the armed forces to fight for the country
2) help get iraq back on its feet and protect the iraqis
3) protecting the US civilians living on US soil

holy shit a 5 year old in armenia with limited media accessibility can tell that you are being duped.

1) if you want to do something patriotic then start by helping those who reside on your own soil. attacking another country is not patriotic, defending your own is. i have yet to see another country launch missiles and deploy weapons on US soil since pearl harbour and hell even that's got something shady about it. don't bring up 9/11. the jury is still out on who REALLY did it cuz we know it wasn't osama and his spelunking buddies.

2) iraq doesn't need your help. they've never asked for it nor wanted it. that's bush and gang successfully brainwashing you highfiving each other behind your back as they all the money rolling in. what is really happening is Bush looting and pillaging their oil with YOUR help resulting in their ability to control the gas prices so they can milk you and everybody else on this forum. the difference is you're still believing whatever bs bush is feeding you.

3) no you are not protecting US civilians. in practice you protect your civilians when they are being attacked on US soil. now they may not be getting bombed but they are getting fucked in every other possible way; examples:

a) industries dumping chemicals in their food and water causing cancer and various other hideous diseases to rise. when these civilians go to get health insurance they get turned down despite having religiously paid premiums throughout their working lives. holy moses i don't see any of you military folks helping these people out.

b) unemployment resulting in homelessness/crime. i've been to OH, MI, NY, DC, PA, VA and saw plenty of homeless ppl, especially in the metro areas. not a single patriotic soldier was helping them. i guess they were busy protecting them by killing iraqi civilians and waving the flag.

IMO the retarded thing about all this is if i were to buy the homeless ppl food or push for electing a president who wants to promote health care i'm labeled a hippie!!!! well guess what, if that's the case i'd rather actively do all that and get labeled a hippie than be a blind bitch who bends over for bush while he simultaneously empties out my bank account.

here comes the back up of my claim

thanks guys i knew i could count on u

:stfu:

F123456
04-21-2008, 10:23 PM
Once again, injecting information into my posts which I never said.

I never said anything about what the student not being allowed to protest as he did. I was speaking in generalities when it came to the symbolism of the flag.

And no, I dont interrogate every homeless "veteran" before I help them out. I just interrogate them, and then dont help them.

Whoops my mistake. I didn't mean to assume you agree with the rest of the service guys. Anyways, I'm glad you don't support the homeless vets because I don't either, just like how I'm not going to support a soldier who I think is full of it.

GhostStriker
04-21-2008, 10:24 PM
2) iraq doesn't need your help. they've never asked for it nor wanted it. that's bush and gang successfully brainwashing you highfiving each other behind your back as they all the money rolling in. what is really happening is Bush looting and pillaging their oil with YOUR help resulting in their ability to control the gas prices so they can milk you and everybody else


And you know this because of all those people in Iraq you have spoken too, right?

ProjectR
04-21-2008, 10:25 PM
I former Marine grunt so that would apply to me based on what has been said in this thread. Generalizing stereotypes posted by people who have no fucking idea including some over motivated military members.

It's a shame that they do have to lower the standards and then have people bitch about it because their too much of a vagina to step up and do the jobs themselves. You must live in an outstanding country where you can get the lower end of society to put their ass on the line so you don't have to do a damned thing but bitch about it. Then declare those people as undesirable meaning you don't have to respect them for being active enough to do shit everyone else won't because they are too busy posting Youtube videos and watching American Idol.
I mean look at the atrocity when it comes to VA healthcare.

The majority of citizens could careless because they aren’t the ones getting so called “benefits” because they are just too fucking self centered to understand that maybe they do owe those that stepped up to fill the spot many don’t want be in. So you have these citizens who look down on those who serve in the military as idiots and criminals while reaping all the perks.

i havent disrespected any member of the military in here even if their views are polar opposite of mine (fanatik lol). i have respect for what they have done for my country.

yes i do bitch about them dropping standards but i will not join the military now or ever. that isnt my calling, for some it is and some it isnt. mine happens to be advertising (which people bitch about all the time and dont step up to do shit). what i do have a problem is the media portraying them as heroes when in fact they could be the rapist and murders that was once locked up in federal pound me in the ass prison. that makes it hard to honor them as heroes because in fact they arent. they chose a job because most (a LARGE amount) of places wont hire them because of their background. it was something they settled on, not wanted. lets see i can sell cars for a living or join the military and kill people like i use to do.

i never once said members of the military are criminals or looked down at them. its just hard to judge who is what when there isnt even a standard anymore.

F123456
04-21-2008, 10:27 PM
I former Marine grunt so that would apply to me based on what has been said in this thread. Generalizing stereotypes posted by people who have no fucking idea including some over motivated military members.

It's a shame that they do have to lower the standards and then have people bitch about it because their too much of a vagina to step up and do the jobs themselves. You must live in an outstanding country where you can get the lower end of society to put their ass on the line so you don't have to do a damned thing but bitch about it. Then declare those people as undesirable meaning you don't have to respect them for being active enough to do shit everyone else won't because they are too busy posting Youtube videos and watching American Idol.
I mean look at the atrocity when it comes to VA healthcare.

The majority of citizens could careless because they aren’t the ones getting so called “benefits” because they are just too fucking self centered to understand that maybe they do owe those that stepped up to fill the spot many don’t want be in. So you have these citizens who look down on those who serve in the military as idiots and criminals while reaping all the perks.

lol sounds like you just described current day america. I'm glad I'm not the only one who believes in what I do then. All I know is that I'm alive while a lot of our soldiers in Iraq died in a war we shouldn't even be in.

GhostStriker
04-21-2008, 10:28 PM
Whoops my mistake. I didn't mean to assume you agree with the rest of the service guys. Anyways, I'm glad you don't support the homeless vets because I don't either, just like how I'm not going to support a soldier who I think is full of it.

Cool man, thats your right, and I am proud to do my small little part to help you and everyone else exercise that. Do I wish some people would "exercise" through other means? Hell yes. But I have come to appreciate both the positives and negitives of freedom.

So long as you dont impinge upon my freedoms, rock on with yours.

*edit* on that note, Im more upset about that "protest" at the school because of the way it impeded life at the school. I believe that it probably had a negitive impact on the learning environment that day, and that is not fair to all the other students.

F123456
04-21-2008, 10:37 PM
examples:

a) industries dumping chemicals in their food and water causing cancer and various other hideous diseases to rise. when these civilians go to get health insurance they get turned down despite having religiously paid premiums throughout their working lives. holy moses i don't see any of you military folks helping these people out.

b) unemployment resulting in homelessness/crime. i've been to OH, MI, NY, DC, PA, VA and saw plenty of homeless ppl, especially in the metro areas. not a single patriotic soldier was helping them. i guess they were busy protecting them by killing iraqi civilians and waving the flag.

IMO the retarded thing about all this is if i were to buy the homeless ppl food or push for electing a president who wants to promote health care i'm labeled a hippie!!!! well guess what, if that's the case i'd rather actively do all that and get labeled a hippie than be a blind bitch who bends over for bush while he simultaneously empties out my bank account.



:stfu:

this is pretty much why i'm posting in this thread. we are blinded by things that really don't matter when there are huge problems here at home that have not been solved. two questions i always ask myself when i read the news headlines about the war:

1. where the hell did we get all the money to fund the war when the nation is in debt?

2. if we had all that money all this time, why aren't we investing it into our own country to solve the issues like the ones in bold above?

Dripto
04-21-2008, 10:38 PM
And you know this because of all those people in Iraq you have spoken too, right?

you are correct.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 10:39 PM
first of all i am NOT standing on your soil so keep that in mind next time you decide to pile that nonsense on me.

where are you then? iraq?

if you open your eyes to actually perceive WTF is really going on you will see that the people you talk of are not going there to protect US soil.

in fact they THINK they are going there for the following reasons:

1) doing something patriotic by joining the armed forces to fight for the country
2) help get iraq back on its feet and protect the iraqis
3) protecting the US civilians living on US soil

holy shit a 5 year old in armenia with limited media accessibility can tell that you are being duped.

1) if you want to do something patriotic then start by helping those who reside on your own soil. attacking another country is not patriotic, defending your own is. i have yet to see another country launch missiles and deploy weapons on US soil since pearl harbour and hell even that's got something shady about it. don't bring up 9/11. the jury is still out on who REALLY did it cuz we know it wasn't osama and his spelunking buddies.

and tell me why no other country has yet to fire missiles upon us?

and i guess the countless secret intelligence briefings that i've attended don't have the info that someone like you has. right?


a) industries dumping chemicals in their food and water causing cancer and various other hideous diseases to rise. when these civilians go to get health insurance they get turned down despite having religiously paid premiums throughout their working lives. holy moses i don't see any of you military folks helping these people out.

b) unemployment resulting in homelessness/crime. i've been to OH, MI, NY, DC, PA, VA and saw plenty of homeless ppl, especially in the metro areas. not a single patriotic soldier was helping them. i guess they were busy protecting them by killing iraqi civilians and waving the flag.

IMO the retarded thing about all this is if i were to buy the homeless ppl food or push for electing a president who wants to promote health care i'm labeled a hippie!!!! well guess what, if that's the case i'd rather actively do all that and get labeled a hippie than be a blind bitch who bends over for bush while he simultaneously empties out my bank account.



:stfu:

so who's fault is it for them being homeless? yours? mine?

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 10:40 PM
this is pretty much why i'm posting in this thread. we are blinded by things that really don't matter when there are huge problems here at home that have not been solved. two questions i always ask myself when i read the news headlines about the war:

1. where the hell did we get all the money to fund the war when the nation is in debt?

2. if we had all that money all this time, why aren't we investing it into our own country to solve the issues like the ones in bold above?

i believe the debt is a part of the military funding.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 10:42 PM
And you know this because of all those people in Iraq you have spoken too, right?

lol exactly.

these civilians think they know everything, and they've never set foot in places like korea or iraq.

Sprint2k
04-21-2008, 10:47 PM
5 1/2 yrs. active duty navy (no longer in)

i respect your views and opinions as well, but like i said before, the respect for the flag and the true meaning of it, is taught throughout your enlistment (or at least it was for me)..

as far as flags on t-shirts, towels, etc...to me, those are just a company print...it's different to toss a shirt w/ a flag on it, on the ground, apposed to it being an actual flag

it's not an actual flag.

if it were actual flags, i would be a lot more pissed.

but there are more things to worry about then some stupid project

Dripto
04-21-2008, 10:47 PM
where are you then? iraq?



and tell me why no other country has yet to fire missiles upon us?

and i guess the countless secret intelligence briefings that i've attended don't have the info that someone like you has. right?




so who's fault is it for them being homeless? yours? mine?

im canadian but that's besides the point now unless you want to use that against me. which no doubt somebody will.

see now that's the problem - you think you need a secret intelligence agency to find out who is planning on firing missiles at you. dude there's a fucking food crisis rearing its ugly head; who gives a rat's ass about attacking another country. other countries don't have war mongering, greedy incumbents. they actually look out for their people and the ongoing socio-economic developments. sure there are some exceptions but they are kept in check to a certain extent unlike Bush in the US.

it doesn't matter who's fault it is, does it? i mean you and i can battle endlessly and relentlessly. fact is whats done is done. the question you should be asking is - what can we DO about these homeless people. a country is not made up of flags, uniforms nor its weapons and armaments. its made up of its people, including the homeless ones.

Sprint2k
04-21-2008, 10:51 PM
do you guys get pissed when the people display the flag horizontally before a football game?

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 10:53 PM
see now that's the problem - you think you need a secret intelligence agency to find out who is planning on firing missiles at you. dude there's a fucking food crisis rearing its ugly head; who gives a rat's ass about attacking another country. other countries don't have war mongering, greedy incumbents. they actually look out for their people and the ongoing socio-economic developments. sure there are some exceptions but they are kept in check to a certain extent unlike Bush in the US.

ya and that's why you have thousands everyday trying to defect to the U.S. :rolleyes:

it doesn't matter who's fault it is, does it? i mean you and i can battle endlessly and relentlessly. fact is whats done is done. the question you should be asking is - what can we DO about these homeless people. a country is not made up of flags, uniforms nor its weapons and armaments. its made up of its people, including the homeless ones.

yes it does matter whose fault it is. unless you are really mentally screwed, it's no one else's fault but that homeless person's for being homeless.

yes it's made up of people.....and the people here run the military.

Dripto
04-21-2008, 10:54 PM
lol exactly.

these civilians think they know everything, and they've never set foot in places like korea or iraq.

did i claim to know everything?? i like how you use the word "civilian". anybody in here who is one can vouch that you are being outright condescending in your tone. is that what they teach in the military along with "dont let the flag touch the ground"???

now did anybody ever step on mars?? how do we know what the atmosphere is like?

no scientist/space explorer will claim to know everything about mars but they sure as hell know a hellava lot based on reading, researching and absorbing everything that is thrown their way and using their brain, past/similar experiences and knowledge to decipher that information.

Dripto
04-21-2008, 11:00 PM
ya and that's why you have thousands everyday trying to defect to the U.S. :rolleyes:



yes it does matter whose fault it is. unless you are really mentally screwed, it's no one else's fault but that homeless person's for being homeless.

yes it's made up of people.....and the people here run the military.

defection!!! that's because america does a fantastic job of advertising their "american dream". hollywood, outside the states or north america is nothing but a ginormous advertising company. but i guess with all that travel under your belt you probably already knew that.

in >85% of the cases- NO IT IS NOT THE HOMELESS PERSON'S FAULT. i challenge you to do this experiment. try applying for a job without providing an address on your resume. any goddamn social work program in any university teaches this fact.

you know what?? at some point in their lives a druggie, junkie, hippie, hooker does want to clean themselves up but they cant simply because they cannot get a goddamn job so they can at least start somewhere. when there's no hope they don't have a choice but to relapse into this dreaded "homelessness" syndrome.

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 11:03 PM
did i claim to know everything?? i like how you use the word "civilian". anybody in here who is one can vouch that you are being outright condescending in your tone. is that what they teach in the military along with "dont let the flag touch the ground"???

yes i am using "civilian" in a condescending way, because people like you think you know anything and everything when someone like myself has been on both sides of the coin.


now did anybody ever step on mars?? how do we know what the atmosphere is like?

poor analogy.

i'm not going to tell you how to do your job or what your job is like, since i've never been in your shoes.

F123456
04-21-2008, 11:16 PM
yes i am using "civilian" in a condescending way, because people like you think you know anything and everything when someone like myself has been on both sides of the coin.




poor analogy.

i'm not going to tell you how to do your job or what your job is like, since i've never been in your shoes.

have you been an infantry man before?

Fanatik
04-21-2008, 11:18 PM
Believe it or not, firefighting has very little to do with flag etiquette... :rolleyes:

That being said, I raised my right hand to swear that I would protect the people of my district, and any member in need.

Clearly you're the immature one ont his subject calling anyone with an opinion stupid just because it doesn't fit with yours.



do me a favor

go back and read the post you quoted. after doing that tell me where i called you " stupid"

seriouisly dont bring your childish bullshit arguments in here if ur gonna make shit up

Fanatik
04-21-2008, 11:22 PM
ruel lock the thread like i said in post 1

90% of crsx is anti military and full douchebag and all of them showed up at once

this was a discussion ebtween us military that brought the scum of crsx in here to bash you guys

lock it up B

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 11:24 PM
by request since this is his thread..

Big Black Boss
04-21-2008, 11:25 PM
have you been an infantry man before?

you don't have to be in an infantry to know how things run in the military. every servicemember, regardless of job, contributes to the mission.