Acura RSX, ILX and Honda EP3 Forum banner

JugginDC5's going for the big numbers build thread

6K views 111 replies 19 participants last post by  BuiltRSX 
#1 · (Edited)
Alright guys. I don't really share too much about my car too often, but I figured I'd document my car a little bit. Maybe get some insight along the way and share my experiences with fellow CRSXers. Well here's the background. I have been buying parts and looking forward to a build for a while now, just kept getting sidetracked with a lot of other things in life. We've all been there at one point. Anyway, about a month ago, after 2 years and 7 months of abuse, I spun a bearing in the loyal k20z1. My tough decision was to stay with the rev-happy 2.0l or step up to the beast, the k24. I have decided to go with the bigger motor in hopes that it will be able to handle more nitrous. Well my power goals are between 275-280whp on motor and around 500whp on spray. I have been doing a lot of research lately and I am confident now in what I know to purchase parts for my setup. Also I have started the process of gutting the car. It is no longer a daily driver for me and I am not too concerned with following a certain rulebook and being competetive at drag events. Everything that can be removed will be ditched. If I can get the car down to 2350lbs w/ me in it, I will be ecstatic. These are my goals. I don't see the problems with achieving them and I hope to have the car running by the end of June. any input would be awesome, opinions welcome. I'll update this as much as possible

So far parts ordered/received:
Kpro
Bottom end
K24A4 block stock sleeves
Wiseco 13.7:1 88mm pistons
Brian Crower bRods
ERL sS2000 modified oil pump
ACL race bearings

Head
Brian Crower stg 3 cams
Brian Crower springs/steel retainers
Blueprint 0.5mm oversize valves
k24A1 head w/ prostreet+ port/polish (349cfm @.550")

Parts yet to be purchased:
Cometic 0.030" 88mm headgasket
ARP headstuds
OEM bearings
RRC manifold
Skunk2 70mm throttle body
Skunk2 exhaust cam gear
ASP aluminum exhaust
1000cc Bosch injectors
Walbro 255lph fuel pump


Parts yet to be decided on:
Header? not sure, would like suggestions
convert to a return line fuel system?

I am not too sure what kind of fuel system requirements will be needed to run the car on e85 and I am also not sure if a bigger fuel system will hurt the car when it is not on e85 (like injectors being too big). Suggestions here will be the most helpful. Thanks a lot guys :)
 
See less See more
#2 · (Edited)
Since it looks like you want to do it right, I would go with an SSR header.

With 500WHP your going to want a return system on the fuel side. Especially with E85 needing more fuel.

Anything over 1000CC injectors and it gets a little harder to tune idles and part throttle cruising.

However, the return system should (from what I understand) help those issues. Naturally, it will aslo reduce your duty cycle.
 
#4 ·
Yea, I have put together a couple motors for my past Hondas, but none have been full blown builds so nothing but the best for this setup. I have considered SSR or Hytech, both are top notch companies so I'm sure whomever I chose I will be more than happy with. I just don't know which company might have more experience with nitrous cars if that matters much.

My thought along the lines with the return line system was to run a -6 or -8 feed line and use the stock feed line as the return line. I'm not sure if that would work or not. Also, by adding a return line I'm not sure how much lower in injector size I could go as a result. I have a feeling 750cc will be near their limits. Do you see any problems with a Walbro 255 not being able to supply enough fuel?


Thanks Ed! If everything continues going as smoothly as it has been, I should be in good shape :)
 
#5 ·
Yea, I have put together a couple motors for my past Hondas, but none have been full blown builds so nothing but the best for this setup. I have considered SSR or Hytech, both are top notch companies so I'm sure whomever I chose I will be more than happy with. I just don't know which company might have more experience with nitrous cars if that matters much.

My thought along the lines with the return line system was to run a -6 or -8 feed line and use the stock feed line as the return line. I'm not sure if that would work or not. Also, by adding a return line I'm not sure how much lower in injector size I could go as a result. I have a feeling 750cc will be near their limits. Do you see any problems with a Walbro 255 not being able to supply enough fuel?
hey call me and let me know what engine parts you need and i will try my best to get them to you!
 
#7 ·
good luck with the build, it seems like your on the right track... only things im curious about is why oem bearings?
if your trying for 500 on nitrous im assuming your doing a multi stage direct port?
any reason why your mixing blueprint valves with BC stuff?
any ideas on what your doing for suspension?
and what are those trannys rated for cause i know ours starts having problems when you hit around 280tq i believe...i could be wrong
 
#8 ·
I want to wish you luck and subscribed!
 
#10 ·
Ravelin
I like the idea of OEM bearings because you can dial in exact tolerances, especially since you can mix and match bearings to get half sizes on the k series. I know my journals and all are not all standard size so if I went ACL the clearances would not be 100% even

Along the lines of nitrous, I've had 2 stages on the car and with kpro I plan on running a 3rd stage as well. Not sure exactly how much in each stage will be run, but that will just be a matter of time and dialing in the jet settings. I plan on running 2 direct port stages and 1 stage with a fogger in the intake.

I decided to go with the blueprint valves because they are nitrided and from my knowledge the brian crower valves are not. Also, my machinist who is doing my head informed me that the majority of valves all come from the same manufacturer and then are just tailored to suit each company's needs.

As for suspension, right now I have the Tein Flex coilovers. I have talked to Tein about a stiffer rear spring and the stiffest they offer for our cars is a 22kg spring. It's unfortunate that they chose a 70mm ID spring for our coilovers because when you get into wanting higher rates they are just not available at all. Even Swift stops at 22kg. I also talked to them about a revalve on the coilovers and am not 100% which direction I need to go so I will be holding off on that until I get the car running and together.

As far as the tranny is concerned. At this point in time I am considering a 4.0 final drive and a possible rebuild. I have faith in the trans since I am not really putting an extreme amount of power down from a stop. If I do run into problems I have a 5 speed as a spare sitting with all my other parts, but I have a lot of faith with the 6 speed. I have been launching the car with bolt-ons and hoosiers for about a year now and my trans has held up perfectly fine. Most of my power won't be put down until 3rd gear I am assuming so the stresses shouldn't be too much more than a n/a car. I'll find out quickly though ha.
 
#11 ·
Umm, do you know how much your crank is turned? Personally OEM bearings are crap, I have had horrible experience from them. I am running the Calico Coating bearing, which is the same bearing on CRSX, the ACL but with ceramic coating. After 17K miles of abuse, and a few races I neglected to put the 3-4quarts of oil in that would top it off, and after I pulled em out, looked brand new. You will have the exact same issue matching aftermarket bearings as you would OEM bearings.

Also, with 4.0FD, I would track the car before doing a tranny change that way you can get the appropriate FD and tire hiegth needed to make it all work for you. It is a bad idea to change FD and tire hiegth then build the motor around that, you will be limited and spending more. Build your setup, then go in and dial in the suspension close, then go in with FD and tire change. You should come out ahead that way.
 
#12 ·
ACL bearings are only one size. I have always been keen on tight tolerances. I like everything to be as perfect as possible in the motor. I'm just weird that way. I feel as if Honda bearings are quality and having 6 different sizes to chose from helps keep everything in line. Personal opinion, to each his own. I will use Honda bearings in every Honda i build :)

Along the lines of final drive. When I was on a single stage 75 shot I was topping out 4th gear and actually had to feather the gas at the end of the quarter because I was out of gear. 5th gear is a weird gear to hit going down the track and I feel as if that shift is a waste of time. I know a 4.0 final drive is gonna give me till about 126mph with a stock size tire which should give me plenty of gear to stay in 4th gear. This 4.76 final drive has been a wall I've been trying to conquer ever since I decided to throw forced induction on the car.

As for the suspension setup. With the 14kg spring in the rear at the moment I have too much squat in the back. The less the better and I think anyone can agree with me on that. Ideally I would love to run a 28-32kg spring in the rear but they do not make that rate of spring in a 70mm ID. I also feel as if a lot more rebound in the front would help me a lot but one change to the suspension at a time and a stiffer rear spring I feel is gonna be the biggest help for the dollar.
 
#13 ·
I am not argueing with you, but confused on what you mean ACL comes in one size and Honda comes in 6. I know you can call ACL, tell them the specs of your crank, and bam, they ship you the size you need for the tolerance you request. I called Calico, and thats how easy it was.

Do you mean, you buy the set all same size with aftermarket, and with OEM you can buy individual? That is what I am thinking your saying.
 
#14 ·
I understand you weren't arguing so I'm sorry if it came across as I was defending. What I mean is if I buy a set of bearings from ACL, they come in a "standard" size. I don't like that. If Calico makes different size bearings then that is news to me. I was not aware. The again that would be a custom set of bearings and that option is almost never advertised. And for a drag car what would you say the main benefit of aftermarket bearings would be?
 
#15 ·
The ceramic coating on the bearings are the benefit, right now my mind is gone, I took some meds, sorry...tomorrow I will explain more, haha...I have had my crank turned .010" on rods/mains, also, they are actually a B18 bearing, forgot which one exactly, they are a tad wider, not much more though. Here is a link to their site, their bearings are actually just an ACL bearing, you can get rods/main/thrust for like 150-160shipped. http://www.calicocoatings.com/ On the site you can find the explaination of the benefits.

Send a PM to Chris or Brian on here asking them what they have to offer, you can get a better deal on here, and be supporting the site. Also, he can tell you more the specs and benefits of the bearings. Also, he will know exactly what to order for you. Try here first, if that fails, call Calico and talk with them, they are very helpful and friendly and know exactly what you would need based on the information you give them. And being their stuff are coated, they will have a lil tighter tolerance.
 
#16 ·
Alright guys. I don't really share too much about my car too often, but I figured I'd document my car a little bit. Maybe get some insight along the way and share my experiences with fellow CRSXers. Well here's the background. I have been buying parts and looking forward to a build for a while now, just kept getting sidetracked with a lot of other things in life. We've all been there at one point. Anyway, about a month ago, after 2 years and 7 months of abuse, I spun a bearing in the loyal k20z1. My tough decision was to stay with the rev-happy 2.0l or step up to the beast, the k24. I have decided to go with the bigger motor in hopes that it will be able to handle more nitrous. Well my power goals are between 275-280whp on motor and around 500whp on spray. I have been doing a lot of research lately and I am confident now in what I know to purchase parts for my setup. Also I have started the process of gutting the car. It is no longer a daily driver for me and I am not too concerned with following a certain rulebook and being competetive at drag events. Everything that can be removed will be ditched. If I can get the car down to 2350lbs w/ me in it, I will be ecstatic. These are my goals. I don't see the problems with achieving them and I hope to have the car running by the end of June. any input would be awesome, opinions welcome. I'll update this as much as possible

So far parts ordered/received:
Kpro
Bottom end
K24A4 block stock sleeves
JE 13.3:1 88mm pistons
Brian Crower bRods
K20z3 oil pump

Head
Brian Crower stg 3 cams
Brian Crower springs/steel retainers
Blueprint 0.5mm oversize valves
k24A1 head w/ prostreet+ port/polish (not sure of cfm yet)

Parts yet to be purchased:
Cometic 0.030" 88mm headgasket
ARP headstuds
OEM bearings
RRC manifold
Skunk2 70mm throttle body
Skunk2 exhaust cam gear
ASP aluminum exhaust
1000cc Bosch injectors
Walbro 255lph fuel pump


Parts yet to be decided on:
Header? not sure, would like suggestions
convert to a return line fuel system?

I am not too sure what kind of fuel system requirements will be needed to run the car on e85 and I am also not sure if a bigger fuel system will hurt the car when it is not on e85 (like injectors being too big). Suggestions here will be the most helpful. Thanks a lot guys :)
you sure you want to do dedicated E85? i did it for a while and hated it

Since it looks like you want to do it right, I would go with an SSR header.

With 500WHP your going to want a return system on the fuel side. Especially with E85 needing more fuel.

Anything over 1000CC injectors and it gets a little harder to tune idles and part throttle cruising.

However, the return system should (from what I understand) help those issues. Naturally, it will aslo reduce your duty cycle.
not true, i can tune RC & precision injectors with no issues on idle and PT and not be super rich. and yes a fuel return will help with fuel system efficiency.

Umm, do you know how much your crank is turned? Personally OEM bearings are crap, I have had horrible experience from them. I am running the Calico Coating bearing, which is the same bearing on CRSX, the ACL but with ceramic coating. After 17K miles of abuse, and a few races I neglected to put the 3-4quarts of oil in that would top it off, and after I pulled em out, looked brand new. You will have the exact same issue matching aftermarket bearings as you would OEM bearings.

Also, with 4.0FD, I would track the car before doing a tranny change that way you can get the appropriate FD and tire hiegth needed to make it all work for you. It is a bad idea to change FD and tire hiegth then build the motor around that, you will be limited and spending more. Build your setup, then go in and dial in the suspension close, then go in with FD and tire change. You should come out ahead that way.
OEM bearing are not crap, you just need to build the motor right.
 
#63 ·
you sure you want to do dedicated E85? i did it for a while and hated it



not true, i can tune RC & precision injectors with no issues on idle and PT and not be super rich. and yes a fuel return will help with fuel system efficiency.



OEM bearing are not crap, you just need to build the motor right.
I said it got harder, didnt say it couldnt be done :p
 
#17 ·
Fade2Black
I don't plan on running the car on e85 all the time. I would like to run on e85 when I am spraying the car or just want to make more power on motor. I wanna make it capable, but it is not feasible in my area to do it all of the time since there is only one gas station in my area that caries it and it's 40 minutes away. I really just wanna be able to run it at the track.

Do you have any suggestions on fuel line sizes, feed and return?
 
#18 ·
-6an feed and use stock line as a return, many turbo guys are able to get to 500whp easily on walbro and 1000's with a 6an feed and stock return

definately look into bosch 1000's if you want a great injector

just remember since you will have pump gas tune and E85 tune you will need to make sure what ever you tune the vehicle on you will need to make sure after that you empty the tank almost completely before switching fuels or tunes will be tweaked
 
#19 ·
Awesome, that's pretty much what i was hoping would be said so that works. Is that 500whp and 1000cc with pump or do you think I might have to look into going higher with e85? I know it's all just speculation, but I don't really know any guaranteed ways to calculate injector size since I'm kinda new to big injectors. But yeah, the Bosch's are number 1 on my injector list so hopefully in a couple weeks I'll be ready to purchase :D
 
#20 ·
bosch 1000's are capable of flowing up to 14-1600cc based on fuel pressure...so you might just want to crank the base fuel pressure up a little

1000 RC's, pump, FPR, -6an feed, stock return have supported 550whp on a couple Turbo RSX's i know of
 
#22 ·
I figured I'd take a chance to post some pics up before it get's ready to go to the machine shop. My pistons and rods are scheduled for delivery on Friday so it's getting to about that time. I can't share anything about the head work being done at the moment since it is at the machine shop getting some much needed attention. Well, I'll stop rambling and post the pics already

The car before going under the knife


The block


The crank


One thing I have been debating is would it be beneficial at all to have the crank lightened or coated. I hear benefits, but I am not sure if the dollar to performance ratio is there. Especially the having the crank lightened. I was quoted $500 by a machine shop here and I am not sure if it would be the right thing for my application. More updates later :)
 
#25 ·
Ummm, I wouldnt worry bout lightning the crank, at most get some oil shedding coating done to it, put that money elsewhere in the motor, or having it balanced with your rods and pistons, that would be worth it and it would live longer and be safer on motor.
 
#27 · (Edited)
Ok, I was just looking for opinions on a lightened crank. The oil shedding coatings and a balance is probably the route I will go as well as micro polished journals. That'll be cheap and effective. :thumbsup:


I am aware of the amount of fuel nitrous will use and that's why I am upgrading the fuel system to handle everything. A big reason I see pressure drop being an issue is when fuel lines are "T'd" into. Having a return line system with a pressure regulator there will be buffer room and I don't see pressure drop being an issue if the injectors are just staying open longer. Maybe some one else can chime in, but if the you're not taking fuel from the injectors, how much pressure drop can there be?

Along the lines of C16, I don't see it in my future, but I will give it a try if e85 does not meet my goals or I feel there is not a big enough safety margin while using it.

And yes the majority of the forum swears by kpro because it is economical and has many options that full standalones have. On top of that it is simple. Simple is good. And when it comes to nitrous, you can dial in the fuel trims a lot better than swapping out jets everytime. Kpro is really the only way to pull timing, it is very specific with fuel management, and can control up to three stages of nitrous. Why not?
 
#29 ·
^^^^There is Greddy e-man, AEM EMS, Kpro, lol...

Anyways, haha, I am curious as to what kinda of fuel you will have to run with the compression and setup your doing, I bet its gotta be some sort of race gas, or the E85. Also, alot of people doing huge shots of nitrous wet, they dont use the same fuel source as your fuel rail, they have a separate tank with separate pump, that is what I will be doing, prob run a 1 gallon fuel cell of C16 to feed my nitrous. But I respect the dry option and for what you are wanting, would be the best setup, and good luck with it, cant wait to see it done, I have been waiting forever and a day on my build, its all there, just need the shop to put it together.
 
#30 ·
Krazy4
I think Kpro atleast for the 02-04 is cheap, considering I've spent $1400 to get it working on my 06 vs. the 900 for the 02

BuiltRSX
I know the compression can be run on 93, it just won't be anywhere near full potential. I wanna keep everything as simple as possible and I just don't wanna see numerous wet stages hanging onto my intake manifold. I would rather run dual walbro pumps to avoid any significant drop in pressure than add another fuel system. It's cool that we're going with different approaches. Get to see the pros and cons of each which is good.

I wish I could say I was just waiting to put everything together haha. I've just been taking everything piece by piece. The amount of money I've spent so far is more than I have expected, but then again I have the mindset of build it right once. It will be nice to see a few badass nitrous dc5s running around. I can't wait
 
#32 ·
I know for a fact that it can be run on pump. My buddy has a 13.5:1 ls/vtec that runs on 93. His car is more tricky because the static compression is so high. With the k-series the vtc can be used to our advantage to bleed off compression in a sense. This allows higher compression number to be run with a higher safety margin. The best part is, when higher octane fuels are used there's an awesome amount of power to be unlocked. Now I do not plan to spray while on 93 octane so no worries about that.

I didn't use to be a nitrous guy. Nitrous is actually the reason I blew up my first motor. It's funny though because now that I understand it's purpose and respect the fact that shortcuts will bite you in the ass, nitrous is a lot of fun. Maybe as more people see the performance that can be attained by using it properly, more people will give it a chance.
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top