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Old 03-19-2010, 03:29 AM   #51
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Hey, one of you meth injection guys should try running E85 through your system once. While it might not be as good as a true water+meth mix, it would be easy and cheap to get. Just a thought.
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Old 03-19-2010, 04:57 AM   #52
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Does E85 have any lubricants in it? I think that is the only reason we aren't able to run other types of gasoline through the systems.
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Old 03-19-2010, 06:09 AM   #53
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70% meth by mass here went from 292whp without to 314whp with meth, once Sam sends me my 3.2 pulley back i will head down to innovative and get re-tuned for 14gph (up from 10gph) 11psi and a better flowing exhaust
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Old 03-19-2010, 06:44 AM   #54
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70% meth by mass here went from 292whp without to 314whp with meth, once Sam sends me my 3.2 pulley back i will head down to innovative and get re-tuned for 14gph (up from 10gph) 11psi and a better flowing exhaust
shit...forgot man. I'll get on that today.
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Old 03-19-2010, 09:44 AM   #55
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70% meth by mass here went from 292whp without to 314whp with meth, once Sam sends me my 3.2 pulley back i will head down to innovative and get re-tuned for 14gph (up from 10gph) 11psi and a better flowing exhaust
so you went from a 50/50 mix that netted 292whp and then just switched to 70/30 mix and netted 314whp? if so that seems to be a significant gain in power just due to the meth percentage.
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Old 03-19-2010, 11:02 AM   #56
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Does E85 have any lubricants in it? I think that is the only reason we aren't able to run other types of gasoline through the systems.
Yeah idk. But, considering that it is 85% alcohol, I don't think there would be any issue.
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Old 03-19-2010, 11:20 AM   #57
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Yeah idk. But, considering that it is 85% alcohol, I don't think there would be any issue.
I realize that all of this is flammable, its just that gas as quite a low flash point and would hesitate somewhat to use it. I would love to be able to use it as my main fuel source though.

ps- my very brief testing, 2 datalogs yesterday, shows me that 100% alchohol does not cool as well as the 70/30 mix I was using. I was showing a total of 50 degrees added to the ambient, where the 70/30 only allowed 25 degrees tops.
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Old 03-19-2010, 01:02 PM   #58
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so you went from a 50/50 mix that netted 292whp and then just switched to 70/30 mix and netted 314whp? if so that seems to be a significant gain in power just due to the meth percentage.

no 292 was without any meth 314 was with meth i can do a few pulls to show the difference between 50 and 70%, i did a ton of reading on the gtp, ss, srt, tc and much more forums that Google mother fucker would bring up, all had more experience with meth than we did came to the conclusion 70% was the sweet spot provided more octane and still provided the proper cooling we needed then went to work and did some measurements to come up with this

also
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Originally Posted by AIS View Post
I found on positive displacement superchargers its helps to have a small percentage of water in the mix. 10-20% water. With it we found slightly better knock control over pure methanol. Keep in mind pure methanol works great too and we are only talking about minor differences when comparing the two.
Rodney
went somewhere in the middle not too crazy but also against the grain i believe Thomas went 70% after i did, we were working on a calc for you guys its done but he is a busy man and will eventually put up a polished version on his site.

Example:
.5 gallon = 64 0z
lets split it 32/32
32 fl oz meth = 32 x 0.05159 = 1.65088 lbs
32 fl ox h20 =32 x 0.0652= 2.0864 lbs

now add 2.0864 and 1.65088 = 3.73728

divide meth lbs into total lbs 1.65088/3.73728 = 0.441733
giving you a 44% by mass mix ratio

meth is at room temp and h20 is at fridge temp (distilled)

Examples:

By mass 50% meth 1 gallon mix = 56 fl oz distiled h20 & 72 fl oz meth
By mass 55% meth 1 gallon mix = 50 fl oz distiled h20 & 78 fl oz meth
By mass 60 % meth 1 gallon mix = 46 fl oz distiled h20 & 82 fl oz meth
By mass 65% meth 1 gallon mix = 38 fl oz distiled h20 & 90 fl oz meth
By mass 70% meth 1 gallon mix = 32 fl oz distiled h20 & 96 fl oz meth
By mass 75% meth 1 gallon mix = 26 fl oz distiled h20 & 102 fl oz meth
By mass 80% meth 1 gallon mix = 22 fl oz distiled h20 & 106 fl oz meth
By mass 85% meth 1 gallon mix = 16 fl oz distiled h20 & 112 fl oz meth
By mass 90% meth 1 gallon mix = 10 fl oz distiled h20 & 118 fl oz meth
By mass 95% meth 1 gallon mix = 6 fl oz distiled h20 & 122 fl oz meth
By mass 100 % meth 1 gallon mix = you got to be kidding me, you fail


above percents were rounded but i can give you exact if you want

H20

fluid ounce (fl oz) 1 = U.S. Weight/Mass pound (lb) = 0.0652

METH

fluid ounce (fl oz) 1= U.S. Weight/Mass pound (lb) = 0.05159


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Originally Posted by stwatson View Post
shit...forgot man. I'll get on that today.
thanks bro, when i come down for any meets ill get some 5gallon jugs of meth for anyone that wants me to get some works out to be like 5.25$ for a gallon of 70% mix much cheaper than buying heet
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Last edited by crxdx; 03-19-2010 at 03:30 PM..
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Old 03-19-2010, 05:25 PM   #59
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no 292 was without any meth 314 was with meth i can do a few pulls to show the difference between 50 and 70%, i did a ton of reading on the gtp, ss, srt, tc and much more forums that Google mother fucker would bring up, all had more experience with meth than we did came to the conclusion 70% was the sweet spot provided more octane and still provided the proper cooling we needed then went to work and did some measurements to come up with this

also

went somewhere in the middle not too crazy but also against the grain i believe Thomas went 70% after i did, we were working on a calc for you guys its done but he is a busy man and will eventually put up a polished version on his site.

Example:
.5 gallon = 64 0z
lets split it 32/32
32 fl oz meth = 32 x 0.05159 = 1.65088 lbs
32 fl ox h20 =32 x 0.0652= 2.0864 lbs

now add 2.0864 and 1.65088 = 3.73728

divide meth lbs into total lbs 1.65088/3.73728 = 0.441733
giving you a 44% by mass mix ratio

meth is at room temp and h20 is at fridge temp (distilled)

Examples:

By mass 50% meth 1 gallon mix = 56 fl oz distiled h20 & 72 fl oz meth
By mass 55% meth 1 gallon mix = 50 fl oz distiled h20 & 78 fl oz meth
By mass 60 % meth 1 gallon mix = 46 fl oz distiled h20 & 82 fl oz meth
By mass 65% meth 1 gallon mix = 38 fl oz distiled h20 & 90 fl oz meth
By mass 70% meth 1 gallon mix = 32 fl oz distiled h20 & 96 fl oz meth
By mass 75% meth 1 gallon mix = 26 fl oz distiled h20 & 102 fl oz meth
By mass 80% meth 1 gallon mix = 22 fl oz distiled h20 & 106 fl oz meth
By mass 85% meth 1 gallon mix = 16 fl oz distiled h20 & 112 fl oz meth
By mass 90% meth 1 gallon mix = 10 fl oz distiled h20 & 118 fl oz meth
By mass 95% meth 1 gallon mix = 6 fl oz distiled h20 & 122 fl oz meth
By mass 100 % meth 1 gallon mix = you got to be kidding me, you fail


above percents were rounded but i can give you exact if you want

H20

fluid ounce (fl oz) 1 = U.S. Weight/Mass pound (lb) = 0.0652

METH

fluid ounce (fl oz) 1= U.S. Weight/Mass pound (lb) = 0.05159



thanks bro, when i come down for any meets ill get some 5gallon jugs of meth for anyone that wants me to get some works out to be like 5.25$ for a gallon of 70% mix much cheaper than buying heet
Brent
Interesting information there...however I have to wonder what was the TRUE reason for 70/30 making more power. Obviously I have tested that added ignition will not net much more power, so the added power had to be from the added cooling. I know that meth will cool FASTER but not MORE than water. Maybe this is why the 70% methanol works so well.

I was unable to get to the post office today...however tomorrow I should definitely be able to. I dont ship stuff very often so its kind of a new thing for me

My tank is almost empty so when I get my new 3 gallon tank I will probably go with your 70/30 suggestion and see how it fairs.
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Old 03-19-2010, 06:44 PM   #60
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I run closer to 80/20 (Meth/Water).... But it varies as I dont exactly measure.

I know its a def a bigger punch compared to a 50/50 though.
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Old 03-19-2010, 10:29 PM   #61
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this is getting me more and more excited.

you gained 22whp with just a 70/30 mix over no meth. at 9psi.

i'm currently running 10psi no meth on a 3.15 and gonna drop to a 3 inch. prob netting 12psi and adding meth.

i wonder what 2 more psi and a meth kit will gain for me once i'm tuned.

great research going on here guys thank you i'm learning alot.
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Old 03-20-2010, 10:36 AM   #62
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crxdx View Post
no 292 was without any meth 314 was with meth i can do a few pulls to show the difference between 50 and 70%, i did a ton of reading on the gtp, ss, srt, tc and much more forums that Google mother fucker would bring up, all had more experience with meth than we did came to the conclusion 70% was the sweet spot provided more octane and still provided the proper cooling we needed then went to work and did some measurements to come up with this

also

went somewhere in the middle not too crazy but also against the grain i believe Thomas went 70% after i did, we were working on a calc for you guys its done but he is a busy man and will eventually put up a polished version on his site.

Example:
.5 gallon = 64 0z
lets split it 32/32
32 fl oz meth = 32 x 0.05159 = 1.65088 lbs
32 fl ox h20 =32 x 0.0652= 2.0864 lbs

now add 2.0864 and 1.65088 = 3.73728

divide meth lbs into total lbs 1.65088/3.73728 = 0.441733
giving you a 44% by mass mix ratio

meth is at room temp and h20 is at fridge temp (distilled)

Examples:

By mass 50% meth 1 gallon mix = 56 fl oz distiled h20 & 72 fl oz meth
By mass 55% meth 1 gallon mix = 50 fl oz distiled h20 & 78 fl oz meth
By mass 60 % meth 1 gallon mix = 46 fl oz distiled h20 & 82 fl oz meth
By mass 65% meth 1 gallon mix = 38 fl oz distiled h20 & 90 fl oz meth
By mass 70% meth 1 gallon mix = 32 fl oz distiled h20 & 96 fl oz meth
By mass 75% meth 1 gallon mix = 26 fl oz distiled h20 & 102 fl oz meth
By mass 80% meth 1 gallon mix = 22 fl oz distiled h20 & 106 fl oz meth
By mass 85% meth 1 gallon mix = 16 fl oz distiled h20 & 112 fl oz meth
By mass 90% meth 1 gallon mix = 10 fl oz distiled h20 & 118 fl oz meth
By mass 95% meth 1 gallon mix = 6 fl oz distiled h20 & 122 fl oz meth
By mass 100 % meth 1 gallon mix = you got to be kidding me, you fail


above percents were rounded but i can give you exact if you want

H20

fluid ounce (fl oz) 1 = U.S. Weight/Mass pound (lb) = 0.0652

METH

fluid ounce (fl oz) 1= U.S. Weight/Mass pound (lb) = 0.05159



thanks bro, when i come down for any meets ill get some 5gallon jugs of meth for anyone that wants me to get some works out to be like 5.25$ for a gallon of 70% mix much cheaper than buying heet
Brent
ok thanks for clearing that up. maybe i will be going with a 70/30 mix after all. i will be on a 18gph. well see how it works.
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Old 03-21-2010, 02:40 PM   #63
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Hey, one of you meth injection guys should try running E85 through your system once. While it might not be as good as a true water+meth mix, it would be easy and cheap to get. Just a thought.
All the octane in the world on e85... but, water/meth is the "intercooler" in this case.

Running a air/water setup or air/air setup on e-85 would be ideal.

You'd have to purchase a new lower manifold, or modify the existing.
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Old 03-21-2010, 04:22 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by crxdx View Post
70% meth by mass here went from 292whp without to 314whp with meth, once Sam sends me my 3.2 pulley back i will head down to innovative and get re-tuned for 14gph (up from 10gph) 11psi and a better flowing exhaust
Don't use E85 in our systems. It will kill the pump in minutes. The gasoline will cause the rubber parts inside to swell causing the pump to fail.

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Old 03-21-2010, 04:23 PM   #65
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Yeah idk. But, considering that it is 85% alcohol, I don't think there would be any issue.
Don't use E85 in our systems. It will kill the pump in minutes. The gasoline will cause the rubber parts inside to swell causing the pump to fail.

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Old 03-29-2010, 07:47 PM   #66
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i wanna say AIS has REALLY impressed me alot.

rodney left me a voicemail while i was out to dinner like less then an hour after my order to let me know that my nozzle selection was what he feels i should go with at this time.

he left me the voicemail while he was off work at his home and really had me feeling comfortable and satisfied i made the right decision.

could not be more excited right now to get this going.

just got my CC stage 4 clutch last week and now im gonna order my hondata 4 bar map sensor. just gotta save up for injectors and its dyno time


rodney if you read this i'm more familar with 8thcivic.com but i do spend some time over here reading the posts as this site is very informative on the K series.

i figure if there is anything going on the guys here have already done it.

Mike.
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Old 03-29-2010, 09:33 PM   #67
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Old 04-05-2010, 09:06 PM   #68
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man i'm dying to see your numbers on 15psi!

is there an eta for dyno day???
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Old 04-06-2010, 01:33 PM   #69
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No ETA yet...but it will be soon...I want to get on the dyno when its at least below 90 degrees, however mother nature has seemed to forget there is a Spring between Winter and Summer.

When it cools down a little I'll hop on there.
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Old 04-06-2010, 08:41 PM   #70
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Good to hear, well hows the butt dyno feel at 15psi???
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Old 04-06-2010, 10:21 PM   #71
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Good to hear, well hows the butt dyno feel at 15psi???
mid range feels stronger....quite stronger. Top end...is a little bit stronger, but not overwhelming. I would ballpark my whp to be in the 330whp range. I'd be happy with that.
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Old 04-06-2010, 11:25 PM   #72
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nice man, youve got a sick setup. its good to see someone finally exploring the potential of the eaton on meth!
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Old 04-07-2010, 06:29 AM   #73
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So I would like to once again thank Sam, Rodney and everyone else that made this water/meth possible. I made a suggestion to Hondata for a feature that would make tuning water/meth a bit better/easier, the post is here if anyone wants to read it.

http://hondata.com/forum/viewtopic.p...b4df3db35c930e

I run leaner than most of you do for personal reasons and really dont talk about it much for the simple fact that I have not got around to building solid evidence (due to a busy schedule) to prove that its safe.... so yeah.
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Old 04-07-2010, 07:13 AM   #74
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hermit9832 View Post
So I would like to once again thank Sam, Rodney and everyone else that made this water/meth possible. I made a suggestion to Hondata for a feature that would make tuning water/meth a bit better/easier, the post is here if anyone wants to read it.

http://hondata.com/forum/viewtopic.p...b4df3db35c930e

I run leaner than most of you do for personal reasons and really dont talk about it much for the simple fact that I have not got around to building solid evidence (due to a busy schedule) to prove that its safe.... so yeah.
I already solved that problem by using both nitrous #1 and nitrous #2 tabs.

Nitrous #1 would engage at 5psi and turn on the pump with NO changes to fuel and ignition

Nitrous #2 would engage at 8psi and my output would be something different (other parameters are the same) and I would make my corrections there....

The delay from 5 to 8psi is enough to get the meth to the motor.
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Last edited by stwatson; 04-07-2010 at 07:16 AM..
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Old 04-07-2010, 10:26 AM   #75
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ahh i didnt know that you were doing that.
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